You're Dead ! (2018-07-17) ​

0:00:01 [Music]
0:00:12 another question which potentially will
0:00:15 bring us into the metaphysical yeah
0:00:22 sorry I protest I was going to say the
0:00:23 thought experiment consisted of actually
0:00:25 thinking about death contemplating what
0:00:27 people will do when you die so actually
0:00:30 living a third-person kind of scene
0:00:33 where you literally your body's put into
0:00:35 the grave and people are going away now
0:00:38 your children are there you know your
0:00:40 parents potentially there as well some
0:00:42 people are there as well you know
0:00:44 they're they're leaving you know you're
0:00:46 thinking about that whole process and
0:00:48 because human beings can't suffer for
0:00:50 too long they can't grieve for too long
0:00:51 so you imagine how your children or your
0:00:54 parents whatever it may be or your
0:00:55 friends after a few days they're
0:00:58 thinking about it they have to now
0:00:59 suppress into the unconscious mind all
0:01:02 of those grievances they forget about
0:01:05 you started this conversation about you
0:01:09 what the important things to talk about
0:01:12 and you said religion and we've been
0:01:14 speaking up that
0:01:18 well that's what you think is what I
0:01:22 mean this is a I agree in a way in a
0:01:31 sense I agree with you that there are
0:01:33 some themes in religion which are as you
0:01:37 can say like I have a Venn diagram there
0:01:38 would be not just religious but either
0:01:40 philosophical or something else or
0:01:41 sociological cycle but this is one of
0:01:44 them death is is a universal theme in
0:01:46 the sense because everyone has to come
0:01:47 to terms with death right so genuinely
0:01:51 do believe that come to terms of their
0:01:53 thinking about it introducing as part of
0:01:56 your weekly or life at you to go back to
0:02:00 highly guy who bring you back that sense
0:02:01 of authenticity grounding right
0:02:04 anchoring I think we all need to find
0:02:17 okay good I'm ask a question weighs it
0:02:23 weighs do you believe in meaning in the
0:02:26 capital M do you believe in actual
0:02:28 meaning and purpose with the capital P
0:02:30 or jus believing a meaning or subjective
0:02:33 just individual they have to find
0:02:38 something has meaning for themselves
0:02:45 that's illusionary so it's not actually
0:02:47 from that perspective it wouldn't be
0:02:49 there was a name an actual meaning an
0:02:51 actual purpose that anchors one to
0:02:54 living a meaningful life
0:03:02 served its purpose so one could argue
0:03:05 the same thing with religion by the way
0:03:06 but not making that argument coming back
0:03:09 to the more important for the sort of
0:03:10 argument the question is this I mean I
0:03:12 don't know what framework you kind of
0:03:14 operate from whether it be like an
0:03:16 evolutionary framework or an atheistic
0:03:18 one human solutions
0:03:24 well I I don't disagree with that but
0:03:28 the question is this I mean what role
0:03:31 does metaphysics relations if there is
0:03:38 something beyond the physical world so
0:03:57 meta wise metaphysical is that which is
0:04:00 above and beyond the material world
0:04:01 which can be extrapolate from the five
0:04:03 senses worship that which is empirically
0:04:05 verifiable if you like that when we talk
0:04:07 about metaphysics we're talking about
0:04:08 that so my thought my point to you is
0:04:10 that if we confine ourselves to the
0:04:14 material then we're going to have
0:04:16 material solutions and problems but if
0:04:18 we expand to the metaphysical realm then
0:04:21 we can start talking about things like
0:04:22 theology and philosophy
0:04:25 so that's what I was going to say that
0:04:27 for example what happens after death
0:04:30 that's a legitimate question and what's
0:04:32 your answer to that and why is that give
0:04:35 me your answer and tell me your
0:04:36 reasoning behind it because when we're
0:04:37 talking about death what we didn't ask
0:04:39 about what happens when you die and
0:04:41 after you why not
0:04:56 and I think some people do yeah I guess
0:05:06 I guess it goes back to what Heidegger
0:05:09 talking about and it says kind of like
0:05:10 kind of suppressing that fool
0:05:12 but let's because we've lived a life
0:05:15 from this earth right and what I believe
0:05:19 one of the things that distinguishes
0:05:20 human beings above and beyond all the
0:05:22 animals is self-contemplation
0:05:24 introspective introspection so here my
0:05:27 question to you is what do you think is
0:05:29 going to happen most probably we used in
0:05:36 some form
0:05:38 she faces
0:05:45 we see why you've explained this
0:05:47 materially what will happen to your body
0:05:49 right and also in the memories of the
0:05:52 people
0:05:54 yeah which were also 100 years from now
0:05:59 if everyone's memories us wiped away
0:06:01 yeah they're nothing nothing exists of
0:06:03 you my question is as follows er I mean
0:06:09 do you think that human beings are made
0:06:11 of just material elements like carbon or
0:06:14 do you think that we're something more
0:06:15 than just carbon introduces desires the
0:06:29 debate in philosophy right there are
0:06:31 three schools of thought broadly
0:06:32 speaking there are materialists also
0:06:36 called physicalists there are duelists
0:06:38 and there are ID lists so materialists
0:06:42 believe that everything that exists is
0:06:45 it's basically material that was she
0:06:48 cannot empirically verify or justify it
0:06:51 doesn't exist in the sense or it's
0:06:54 meaningless I wouldn't say it does exist
0:06:55 they will say it's meaningless
0:06:57 it's a meaningless proposition and there
0:06:59 was a school of thought called logical
0:07:01 positivism that flourished in the
0:07:03 nineteen twenties and thirties which
0:07:04 kind of pushed this materialists way of
0:07:07 thinking
0:07:10 okay I apologize let me try a break it
0:07:11 down some people believe that all that
0:07:14 exists is physical things some other
0:07:18 people say no actually what you have is
0:07:21 physical things and met and other things
0:07:24 metaphysical things it could be anything
0:07:28 for example mathematics and number can't
0:07:32 be seen
0:07:33 it can't be smoked it can't be dealt
0:07:36 with you can't put it under a microscope
0:07:38 it cannot go through the scientific
0:07:40 method and that's why by the way by the
0:07:43 40s and 50s this way for logical
0:07:47 positivism became very weak and in fact
0:07:49 they retracted those materialists and
0:07:51 positivists they kind of retracted this
0:07:53 whole verification principle they
0:07:55 realized that things like this
0:07:56 mathematics can't be justified now why
0:07:58 am I telling you this the reason why I'm
0:08:00 telling you this is because there's an
0:08:01 age-old discussion
0:08:02 are we minds and bodies or are we just
0:08:06 bodies because if we assume that we're
0:08:09 just bodies then when we die necessarily
0:08:11 what that means is that we're going to
0:08:13 be we're going to cease to exist
0:08:14 but if we accept that way our minds and
0:08:17 bodies what do lists for example would
0:08:20 say that we're not just bodies that
0:08:23 despite the body we have experienced for
0:08:26 example through dreams because when
0:08:28 we're dreaming we're not going we're not
0:08:31 actually interacting with the extraneous
0:08:34 variables we're not interacting with the
0:08:35 world yet we have a whole experience in
0:08:39 a dream you've had a dream before right
0:08:40 so the point is this is that when we die
0:08:44 what's going to happen if we say we're
0:08:47 just bodies it makes sense for us to say
0:08:49 okay for for just body is no problem
0:08:51 the body will cease to exist and nothing
0:08:53 will happen but if we our minds and
0:08:56 which is the prevailing school of
0:08:58 thought and philosophy and by the way
0:09:00 most philosophers the vast majority of
0:09:03 philosophers believe in this that we're
0:09:05 not just you cannot just be bodies not
0:09:07 just particles we're not were more than
0:09:10 that
0:09:14 what are you saying about it no it
0:09:16 doesn't yeah you're right it doesn't
0:09:18 necessary that yeah you were asking me
0:09:20 about
0:09:22 what I understand don't want to think
0:09:23 about metaphysics door
0:09:26 money differently so
0:09:30 there are things that transcendent to
0:09:33 normal every night yes we like
0:09:35 experience for symphony
0:09:40 perfect yeah so it's Burris yes when you
0:09:45 talk about
0:09:48 you know a different level
0:09:52 you're absolutely right about that
0:09:55 you're absolutely and that's exactly
0:09:56 what philosophers site they say that
0:09:58 first-person subjective experiences are
0:10:01 examples of something which is not
0:10:03 tangible or scientific because for
0:10:06 something to be scientific has to be
0:10:07 said personal science isn't a third
0:10:10 person third person is he/she by the way
0:10:14 when we say first person I'm talking
0:10:15 about that which relates to me I write
0:10:18 third person is he/she so what do we
0:10:20 mean by science is third person science
0:10:22 is you doing something to something else
0:10:25 and seeing the results of that a third
0:10:27 person whereas what you've just
0:10:29 described I believe quite correctly
0:10:30 right the orchestra the symphony
0:10:33 whatever you want to say they're walking
0:10:34 on the mountains it's first-person no
0:10:37 one can deny your first-person
0:10:40 experience experience
0:10:47 exactly now the point is when we dream
0:10:50 we're going through those experiences
0:10:52 again there are no material things
0:10:53 around us in the actual dream you could
0:10:55 say they're mental constructs but the
0:10:58 more realm does that in what room does
0:11:00 that exist in does it exist right now if
0:11:04 we take this questioning to the
0:11:07 post-death experience because do you
0:11:10 know what I mean we talked about science
0:11:12 briefly science is just an accumulation
0:11:15 of historical events and the assumption
0:11:18 that history will repeat itself through
0:11:20 patterns and laws that's what history
0:11:22 that's what science is if we use the our
0:11:25 approach will find that when we when
0:11:27 we're sleeping for example we're leaving
0:11:29 the conscious mind to the unconscious in
0:11:31 other words we our consciousness is
0:11:34 suspended temporarily and then we'll
0:11:36 come back to what we think is the robot
0:11:38 right in that context in that context we
0:11:43 could argue that we're having an
0:11:45 experience which is a very real
0:11:47 experience yeah now if that's our
0:11:49 experience of losing consciousness death
0:11:51 is an extension of losing consciousness
0:11:53 you will lose consciousness and death to
0:11:56 accept that premise how can we
0:11:59 how could we ascertain well how can we
0:12:01 say for certain that when we die we're
0:12:03 not going to go into that space again
0:12:05 that domain again which is as real as
0:12:08 this domain which has all these things
0:12:10 in it which are sometimes traditionally
0:12:12 called religious yes I am exactly yeah
0:12:21 that's exactly what the Prophet Muhammad
0:12:22 said is he said one time this is the
0:12:24 sister of sleep or sleep resist or death
0:12:35 what happens so you we have our
0:12:48 respective faiths that's the last
0:12:57 edition but here we're talking about
0:12:59 things which we can do the thing is we
0:13:01 have to think about how we reach
0:13:02 conclusions right how do you come to
0:13:05 conclusions I'll put to you that
0:13:06 everything you can pry out there which
0:13:09 is supposedly so even your own existence
0:13:11 can be rigorously criticized anything in
0:13:16 your existence
0:13:18 but I will say - is this what we do as
0:13:21 human beings whether it be normally or
0:13:24 not is we kind of we apply a
0:13:27 probabilistic reasoning probability so
0:13:32 we said I'm probably here right now
0:13:33 because everything signals to that yeah
0:13:35 it feels like that is so with everything
0:13:39 exactly so we apply that kind of
0:13:41 reasoning right now what I'm saying to
0:13:43 you is that will apply the same
0:13:44 reasoning that same kind of influential
0:13:47 sometimes it's called inferential
0:13:49 reasoning inferences yeah we can make a
0:13:52 very similar case for life after death
0:14:21 the prints on how you define logic right
0:14:23 because we can make a very clear case
0:14:29 everything that begins to exist has a
0:14:31 cause
0:14:34 the universe began to exist therefore
0:14:36 the universe has of course traditional
0:14:39 argument very logical where is the
0:14:42 course it must have power and must have
0:14:44 knowledge of must have whatever that
0:14:46 causes therefore God or whatever you
0:14:48 wanted to find the cause as as the
0:14:50 attributes of a conventional God right
0:14:52 so from that as a logical deduction and
0:14:55 we've come to a conclusion that has a
0:14:57 cause a creator through that logical
0:14:59 deduction so it depends on what kind of
0:15:01 ones that you're talking about
0:15:02 biological II mean empiricism looking at
0:15:05 some three or five senses yeah I would
0:15:07 agree with you right wife you're talking
0:15:08 about deduction but you can't exactly
0:15:22 well you can't prove the existence of
0:15:23 logic to science did you see this point
0:15:28 logical principles are metaphysical in
0:15:30 nature axioms mathematical axioms and
0:15:33 even the whole field of mathematics is
0:15:35 metaphysical there's no physical
0:15:38 evidence of maths none whatsoever
0:15:41 there's no physical evidence of logic so
0:15:44 rolling itself can't be scientifically
0:15:46 verified and that's one of the reasons
0:15:49 why verification ism as is known by many
0:15:53 different philosophers was even they
0:15:56 like area for example aja he wrote a
0:15:58 book called language truth and logic
0:16:00 yeah and he was making a very similar
0:16:02 argument to hero in 1933 and this book
0:16:05 it was saying that only those things
0:16:07 which you can see is that what you can
0:16:09 verify is that which has meaning
0:16:11 anything else is meaningless and he saw
0:16:14 an interview with him in 1976 and he
0:16:18 categorically took back what he believed
0:16:20 before say verification ISM weak or
0:16:23 strongly verification ISM is actually it
0:16:26 cannot be sustained sure had to be had
0:16:28 to undergo shoes why because of these
0:16:30 questions things like mass can not be
0:16:32 ascertained through science through
0:16:34 verification
0:17:00 yeah I'll put you that if you want to
0:17:03 find this objective purpose it's easier
0:17:05 to do can just make one up
0:17:06 and it can be unethical by the standards
0:17:08 of the day Hitler on a subjective
0:17:10 purpose of life and was an emetic
0:17:12 everyone can find this objective rapist
0:17:14 can have a subjective purpose of life
0:17:15 anyone can have that but what we're
0:17:17 saying is that is there a mean a meaning
0:17:19 are we here for a reason
0:17:21 or are we just
0:17:47 why do you think we feel so good about
0:17:49 ourselves to reduce how can you explain
0:17:52 that it helps the equation
0:18:03 [Music]
0:18:09 maybe
0:18:12 I'm here to country