Sapience Institute Live - With Mohammed Hijab and Subboor Ahmad (2021-02-06) #

0:00:01 assalamualaikum
0:00:03 welcome to sapience institute
0:00:06 live we are going to be interacting with
0:00:10 you guys today just like last week
0:00:14 we are going to have an open question
0:00:17 and answer session
0:00:18 dealing with the issues which are most
0:00:20 important
0:00:22 in the world today when it comes to
0:00:24 atheism
0:00:26 liberalism darwinism scientism feminism
0:00:31 and all of the other things that keep
0:00:32 muhammad hijab awake or rather his
0:00:35 opponents
0:00:36 awake at night so how are you doing mr
0:00:38 hijab
0:00:39 how you doing so how did you find last
0:00:42 week's live stream
0:00:43 it was good it's good to hear like it's
0:00:46 very important for us to get feedback
0:00:48 for because we're obviously putting out
0:00:49 a lot of material uh in the week during
0:00:51 the week we're filming a lot more than
0:00:52 we're putting out
0:00:53 yeah so in terms of the videos we try
0:00:56 and put like free
0:00:56 free saving for videos out every single
0:00:59 week but we're filming probably
0:01:01 nine to 12 videos a week
0:01:04 and so it's good in terms of feedback to
0:01:08 get the feedback from the
0:01:09 from the live audience to see what the
0:01:11 kind of concerns are
0:01:12 yeah um we're kind of drawing to a close
0:01:15 when it comes to the scientific errors
0:01:16 narrative and responding to it
0:01:18 um we've pretty much recorded everything
0:01:21 that we think
0:01:22 are the main contentions on that um so
0:01:25 obviously
0:01:26 in terms of our own projects and
0:01:27 feedback on it it would be good to get
0:01:28 from the
0:01:29 from from from the viewers if they have
0:01:32 any particular contentions that they
0:01:33 want us
0:01:34 to cover in the in the videos that's
0:01:36 something as well
0:01:37 um but not just on the science on the
0:01:40 scientific
0:01:41 era's narrative or the scientific
0:01:42 miracles narrative but also
0:01:44 generally in terms of morality or
0:01:47 because that's
0:01:47 that's going to be something we're going
0:01:48 to spend a lot of time on reality and
0:01:50 feminism and
0:01:50 liberalism and women's rights and
0:01:52 so-called rights in islam and
0:01:54 those kinds of topics yeah and i think
0:01:57 it's been very important that when it
0:01:59 comes to
0:02:00 you know the way that sapience works is
0:02:02 we decisively inshallah deal with one
0:02:05 topic and then move on to another
0:02:07 and i i mean i i don't know i think
0:02:10 we're pretty close to wrapping up the
0:02:12 entire
0:02:13 scientific uh miracles errors in the
0:02:16 quran narrative
0:02:17 in a way the narrative is already dealt
0:02:19 with but decisively dealing with all
0:02:22 of the counter contentions that people
0:02:24 um
0:02:25 try and make now before we get into that
0:02:28 um and as the audience is warming up and
0:02:30 people are asking when they could
0:02:32 uh have the link to actually join we're
0:02:34 gonna throw it out
0:02:35 very soon just before that um
0:02:38 i just want to touch upon an important
0:02:40 topic right
0:02:42 when it comes to science the very
0:02:45 problem with the scientific miracles in
0:02:48 the quran or the scientific errors in
0:02:50 the quran or whatever people are trying
0:02:51 to
0:02:51 come up with is all of it really stems
0:02:55 from
0:02:55 scientism because what happens is
0:02:58 science
0:02:59 if someone says uh they are
0:03:03 i don't know sociological problems with
0:03:05 the quran right
0:03:06 uh and then you turn around and say what
0:03:08 do you mean oh you know this social
0:03:09 theorist said this but the quran is
0:03:11 telling you
0:03:12 this is how society should be framed
0:03:14 yeah people won't really take that
0:03:15 seriously because they see
0:03:17 sociology as subjective they see it as
0:03:20 a human construct a social construct in
0:03:23 fact and they see that
0:03:24 there is a lot of um theory-ladenness as
0:03:28 in the theory is coloring the data of
0:03:30 sociology
0:03:30 so it wouldn't be an undercutting
0:03:32 argument to say the quran is undermined
0:03:34 by uh some social theory but when it
0:03:36 comes to science it's like no
0:03:38 no this is objective so if there's a
0:03:40 scientific contention
0:03:41 as if there's no theory-relatedness as
0:03:43 if there's no uh you know
0:03:45 uncertainty in terms of conclusions
0:03:47 changing or interpretations of the
0:03:49 verses or interpretations of scientific
0:03:51 theories
0:03:51 so again it comes down to scientism
0:03:55 so i i'm going to throw out the link
0:03:56 actually early today
0:03:59 um because we want to interact as you're
0:04:01 doing that just can you tell them
0:04:02 what scientism means very good point mr
0:04:05 hijab
0:04:06 so scientism is the excessive belief
0:04:10 in the scientific method beyond this
0:04:12 capacity meaning
0:04:14 that you believe science is the be-all
0:04:16 and the end-all
0:04:17 science undermines god's existence
0:04:19 science gives you certainty science is
0:04:21 the only root of knowledge
0:04:23 and science becomes a way of actually
0:04:26 not only looking at the natural
0:04:28 world but becomes an epistemic root and
0:04:31 the only
0:04:32 epistemic root and that's where things
0:04:35 get
0:04:36 hairy so just before
0:04:40 we go live just a few comments here guys
0:04:43 because last time as well many many
0:04:46 people
0:04:47 were trying to join the live many many
0:04:49 people were
0:04:50 commenting we usually have a certain
0:04:53 part where people join and they're like
0:04:54 oh my god it's mamma dijab let's limit
0:04:57 that
0:04:58 oh my god
0:05:02 let's leave this especially with our
0:05:03 long hair yes yes
0:05:05 so we both go longer yes we do but
0:05:08 i think yours is is growing up yours is
0:05:11 trying to reinforce
0:05:12 the tree of life
0:05:16 okay so let's start off with bosnian
0:05:20 muslims
0:05:29 are you from bosnia you're in bosnia
0:05:32 right now no i live in germany
0:05:34 or you live in germany i actually
0:05:36 remember the last last time i was oh and
0:05:38 you actually wanted to ask me something
0:05:39 before i left i don't know if you
0:05:40 remember
0:05:42 maybe that was the question yes go ahead
0:05:45 um so does my can i ask like any
0:05:47 question does it have to be directed to
0:05:49 a topic
0:05:50 um well the topic obviously a sapience
0:05:52 institute is we don't deal with quick we
0:05:54 don't deal with
0:05:55 political issues what we do deal with is
0:05:58 feminism darwinism
0:05:59 scientific scientists and ism and
0:06:02 related topics so anything in regards to
0:06:04 that will be perfectly
0:06:05 well i guess i could ask you something
0:06:07 but i guess macroevolution if that's
0:06:09 okay
0:06:10 um my question is right i always see
0:06:13 like
0:06:14 atheists always like commenting about
0:06:15 you know there's so much evidence for it
0:06:17 right
0:06:18 my question generally is why does that
0:06:21 even con
0:06:21 like contradict islam if if it even does
0:06:24 because
0:06:25 look if if if a macro evolution is
0:06:28 speciation right
0:06:29 then why does a fish becoming a monkey
0:06:32 somehow
0:06:32 disprove adam's creation
0:06:36 okay so um firstly brother
0:06:40 eddin the first thing i want to do is
0:06:42 regardless of whether
0:06:44 it contradicts the quran or not that's a
0:06:46 different matter which we
0:06:48 deal with let's look at their claim
0:06:51 there's so much evidence for
0:06:52 macroevolution
0:06:53 right and if you actually ask them
0:06:56 what is your evidence for macroevolution
0:06:59 they will say
0:07:01 well micro evolution because if you can
0:07:04 walk
0:07:05 five miles you can
0:07:08 walk 500 miles so the essential argument
0:07:11 is if small scale changes
0:07:13 plus long deep time equals
0:07:17 massive changes over a long period of
0:07:19 time that's their basic argument
0:07:21 now there's some serious issues with
0:07:22 this the first one
0:07:24 is the fallacy of equivocation so what
0:07:26 this is doing
0:07:28 is this is equivocating two
0:07:31 different types of processes micro
0:07:34 evolutionary processes
0:07:36 cannot be equated to macro evolutionary
0:07:39 process so when it comes to okay
0:07:42 think of it this way let's um paul
0:07:44 nelson who i just had on my channel
0:07:46 yeah i saw that stream um he gave a very
0:07:49 good
0:07:49 analogy if you were watching uh since
0:07:51 you were watching brother eden
0:07:52 he gave the analogy that you see
0:07:55 when we think of you know darwinian
0:07:59 evolution it's like a plane
0:08:00 flying and when the plane is flying in
0:08:03 mid-air
0:08:04 you change the components of the engine
0:08:07 but you change them in such a way that
0:08:10 you don't cause a disruption that the
0:08:11 plane comes down and crashes
0:08:13 so there's a constraint on what's
0:08:15 possible
0:08:17 it's a really good really good analogy
0:08:19 you can't have a
0:08:21 you have a principle of continuity you
0:08:23 can't have
0:08:24 let's just stop let's just restart no no
0:08:26 you have that
0:08:28 strain throughout and just uh tell them
0:08:30 who
0:08:31 he is yes yes very very good point paul
0:08:33 nelson
0:08:34 is a philosopher of biology he is
0:08:37 somebody who
0:08:38 by the way anybody seen that very
0:08:40 popular documentary
0:08:42 uh in which richard dawkins is talking
0:08:44 about aliens and
0:08:46 and maybe we were created by aliens you
0:08:48 know and uh
0:08:49 uh this has been seen by millions of
0:08:51 people all across the world
0:08:53 it's called expelled no intelligence
0:08:54 allowed millions of views uh
0:08:57 and it's popular and if you watch in
0:09:00 that documentary
0:09:01 they show leading biologists and
0:09:04 philosophers of biology
0:09:05 who um challenge darwinian evolution and
0:09:08 paul nelson you'll see him throughout
0:09:09 the documentary
0:09:10 in fact the discovery institute of which
0:09:13 paul
0:09:13 is a fellow is the one behind the
0:09:16 documentary and paul nelson
0:09:18 is the one who made the risky prediction
0:09:21 uh about 20 years ago about orphan dna
0:09:24 that they there is dna which doesn't fit
0:09:27 okay let me just give a i think it's
0:09:29 worth every everybody knowing
0:09:31 so in terms of our genome
0:09:35 the darwinists will always try and link
0:09:37 it back to some
0:09:38 parental species some other organisms
0:09:41 and going back
0:09:42 until they have this beautiful tree
0:09:44 however
0:09:46 what nelson's been saying for a very
0:09:48 long time is that
0:09:50 no there is data there there is dna
0:09:53 there
0:09:54 which doesn't fit the tree and there
0:09:56 were some anomalous
0:09:58 uh data that was coming out which wasn't
0:10:00 fitting the tree of life
0:10:01 and at that particular time scientists
0:10:03 said this is
0:10:04 a a a sample error oh this could be
0:10:08 explained due to this and they had all
0:10:09 these
0:10:10 uh type of ideas uh to to challenge it
0:10:14 however he said no no it's gonna
0:10:16 increase exponentially it's going to be
0:10:18 a lot more and that's what it turned out
0:10:19 to be the case so
0:10:20 if you look at the graph and uh if you
0:10:23 go to my channel
0:10:24 you will see that he actually has a
0:10:25 chart with all the data
0:10:27 and this is like the early 90s i saw the
0:10:29 the early
0:10:30 early 2000s and then the the anomalous
0:10:33 data becomes
0:10:34 almost skyrockets this way right
0:10:37 so uh paul nelson who was the example of
0:10:41 you know the engine and this type of
0:10:42 thing
0:10:43 um and also something else which i spoke
0:10:45 to him about which i think is very
0:10:46 important is worth noting here
0:10:48 um kuhn who uh you know hijab myself
0:10:52 others have studied he speaks about
0:10:54 normal science
0:10:55 and revolutionary science so in
0:10:58 in a way uh this is what me and paul
0:11:01 were speaking about when it comes to
0:11:03 orphan dna
0:11:04 now think about a revolution the french
0:11:07 revolution
0:11:08 in terms of the french revolution you
0:11:10 have the monarchy
0:11:11 they are the people in the castle with
0:11:13 the country
0:11:14 with the power then you have the
0:11:16 revolutionaries who are saying your
0:11:18 system's wrong
0:11:19 your system's corrupt so [ __ ] used this
0:11:23 as a you know he used um
0:11:27 scientific uh paradigms uh
0:11:30 uh he you know use language which
0:11:32 likened them to
0:11:33 like a political paradigm so when you
0:11:36 have a prevailing
0:11:37 regime and then you have people on the
0:11:39 outside saying you're wrong you're wrong
0:11:41 those are the revolutionaries but the
0:11:44 people who are running the regime
0:11:46 they are known as the the ones carrying
0:11:50 working within the normal research
0:11:52 framework or normal science
0:11:53 and what they'll do is every time a
0:11:55 revolutionary will say
0:11:57 this thing is wrong they will try to
0:11:59 reinterpret it in their theory
0:12:01 so they'll keep doing that until the
0:12:03 pressure builds there's so many
0:12:04 anomalies
0:12:05 that you have to have a paradigm shift
0:12:07 and the revolution
0:12:08 so a really good example is
0:12:12 newtonian mechanics there's a very very
0:12:14 interesting historical
0:12:16 uh story here uh which i think all of us
0:12:19 should really memorize because
0:12:20 it's it's really worth understanding so
0:12:24 the newtonian world view worked well for
0:12:27 well over 200 years if you predicted
0:12:30 where is a planet gonna be
0:12:32 in six months from now that's exactly
0:12:34 where it would be if you
0:12:36 did equations correctly and obviously
0:12:38 there's
0:12:39 there's assumptions about time in space
0:12:40 is fixed and and this type of stuff
0:12:42 however when the newtonian
0:12:45 uh world view was used to actually
0:12:49 predict the behavior of the planet
0:12:52 mercury
0:12:53 what happened was it was wobbling it
0:12:56 wasn't doing
0:12:57 what the newtonian worldview was saying
0:12:59 it's going to be doing the
0:13:00 attorney model is saying it's going to
0:13:02 be doing so what scientists said
0:13:04 is okay newton can't be wrong newton's
0:13:07 been
0:13:07 right for so long and we've done all
0:13:09 this amazing uh
0:13:11 we've we've developed science we've
0:13:13 developed technologies based on
0:13:15 mutant there's no way he can be wrong so
0:13:17 they are working within normal science
0:13:18 so what happened is they said well you
0:13:20 see there must be a planet out there
0:13:23 called vulcan and the planet must be
0:13:26 interfering it must be
0:13:28 causing mercury to wobble because of its
0:13:31 gravitational pull
0:13:32 right and so that became
0:13:35 a sort of a story which is used in
0:13:38 science to show
0:13:40 and obviously vulcan didn't exist and
0:13:42 einstein came later on and showed
0:13:43 through
0:13:44 general relativity that time in space is
0:13:46 flexible and
0:13:47 uh that anomalous data fitted with his
0:13:49 theory not with newton's theory
0:13:51 but but but but the scientific community
0:13:53 understands
0:13:54 they can make mistakes of the vulcan
0:13:57 type
0:13:58 they can come up with ad hoc
0:13:59 rationalizations
0:14:01 to fix an existing theory now what it is
0:14:05 with macroevolution or with orphan or
0:14:08 orphan
0:14:08 genes is the darwinists will always
0:14:12 find their vulcans they will always find
0:14:15 their way of fitting and plugging the
0:14:18 data
0:14:19 and when it comes to uh the issue of of
0:14:23 macro evolution
0:14:24 there are basic things and i just want
0:14:26 to raise this point
0:14:28 basic foundational things
0:14:31 which are completely uh missing when it
0:14:34 comes to the darwinian explanations for
0:14:36 example
0:14:38 um in 2016 at the royal society in
0:14:41 london they had a meeting
0:14:43 between various different biologists and
0:14:45 the meeting was about whether darwin is
0:14:47 right in natural selection and that
0:14:49 sounds strange because since 1859
0:14:52 you know everyone's been singing and
0:14:54 dancing that you know oh
0:14:55 darwin was right in the royal society
0:14:59 uh 2016. okay and the interesting thing
0:15:02 hijab about royal society
0:15:04 is the royal society's oldest society in
0:15:06 the world
0:15:07 it's the very same society in which 1858
0:15:10 darwin first came to publish his theory
0:15:14 and then published it the next year in
0:15:16 1859
0:15:17 and they are not some religious
0:15:19 instruments we're having a debate
0:15:21 whether he's right
0:15:22 and it was about his core
0:15:25 mechanics which by the way are supposed
0:15:28 to explain macro evolution
0:15:30 but guess what they don't even explain
0:15:32 the origin of body plans
0:15:34 which is the foundational problem so the
0:15:36 the issue really
0:15:38 here is
0:15:44 uh you know the whole third way
0:15:45 evolution thing yeah with dennis noble
0:15:48 yeah yeah yeah yeah absolutely is he
0:15:50 part of it
0:15:51 yes so very good question yeah on the
0:15:54 third wave of evolution you're going to
0:15:55 have people like
0:15:56 eva blanca who believes in new
0:15:59 lamarchism
0:16:00 she was actually there at the conference
0:16:02 so these are people
0:16:03 who um they see they say there has to be
0:16:07 an
0:16:07 alternative to the darwinian uh
0:16:09 framework and they
0:16:11 because it's not fitting the data
0:16:12 however uh this is something very very
0:16:15 important
0:16:15 i'm going to get hijab to work out the
0:16:17 answers here not myself yeah
0:16:20 um
0:16:23 he's actually walking masha'allah um so
0:16:28 i got distracted yeah where's the
0:16:30 marriage documentary bro
0:16:32 um so anyway am i still in my
0:16:34 revolutionary
0:16:48 anyway i actually forgot what i was
0:16:50 saying i just saw ali dawa
0:16:52 society in 2016 yeah there you go
0:16:56 so um this whole idea that they've
0:16:59 explained it
0:17:00 is not right at all in fact um
0:17:04 and yes i remember now what i was saying
0:17:06 what i was saying was
0:17:08 even though there's these alternatives
0:17:11 no matter what they still have to go
0:17:13 back to
0:17:14 some sort of darwinian framework and i
0:17:16 want to find i want to grill hijab to
0:17:18 find out why
0:17:20 well because of origin um
0:17:24 why okay even uh brother eden yeah
0:17:27 please why
0:17:28 he's in hell here why do they just pull
0:17:30 back the
0:17:32 this is a very difficult question i
0:17:35 didn't work out the answer until it came
0:17:37 a very long time
0:17:38 and in fact you know people like philip
0:17:41 johnson and others have pointed this out
0:17:43 in the 1990s but uh
0:17:46 you know it it is something which is
0:17:48 quite hard to grasp
0:17:49 long story short methodological
0:17:52 naturalism all right
0:17:54 methodological naturalism is the only
0:17:56 game in town which means
0:17:58 uh ali is trying to distract us with his
0:18:01 comments
0:18:02 so methodological naturalism is the only
0:18:05 game in town
0:18:06 right therefore no can you explain it
0:18:09 because
0:18:10 he's different he said marriage is
0:18:13 evolving
0:18:16 the assumption that there's no
0:18:17 supernatural when you're doing science
0:18:19 okay fine but why would that lead to a
0:18:22 conclusion
0:18:23 that life has to uh life had to evolve
0:18:27 with that
0:18:28 through some natural processes because
0:18:30 there's no there's no alternative
0:18:32 okay then why do they stick with darwin
0:18:34 darwinism and not something else
0:18:36 yeah that's a good question why do they
0:18:38 have to stick to darwinism or something
0:18:39 else
0:18:40 because you could technically have an
0:18:41 evolution that's not darwinism yes you
0:18:43 can
0:18:43 but yes exactly now good yeah but why do
0:18:46 they stick darwinism
0:18:49 um okay because
0:18:52 amongst the other models the other
0:18:54 models
0:18:55 like for example natural genetic
0:18:57 engineering or neural mechanism or
0:18:58 neoliberalism
0:19:00 the problem is they open up the door
0:19:03 closer to theistic compatibility oh
0:19:06 really
0:19:06 yes it's like natural genetic
0:19:08 engineering and there's gaps
0:19:10 there right with darwinism it's
0:19:11 all-encompassing
0:19:13 so let's just just as a question your
0:19:15 question no la marxism for example
0:19:18 uh so lamar believed that the giraffe
0:19:20 elongates its neck because it keeps
0:19:21 reaching for the leaves
0:19:22 and then it is these these traits are
0:19:24 going to be inherited by the
0:19:27 readings
0:19:31 you know did you start applying it to
0:19:35 [Laughter]
0:19:36 yourself
0:19:42 yes i'm guessing that if these traits
0:19:45 are all hereditary
0:19:47 um i'm trying to guess why this is more
0:19:50 theistic or more in line with
0:19:52 okay there's gaps okay yeah so where is
0:19:54 that coming from
0:19:56 that tendency yeah so you see that's why
0:20:00 some people thought that lamarck's ideas
0:20:02 were incomplete
0:20:03 right the thing is with darwinism it
0:20:05 explains ev
0:20:07 by explains i mean they have a story for
0:20:09 everything in a purely naturalistic way
0:20:11 yeah but with the other ones like
0:20:12 natural genetic engineering
0:20:14 where for example mutations are not
0:20:16 random they're directed
0:20:18 mutations where where the organism
0:20:22 decides okay i need this yeah all of
0:20:25 those things they can have
0:20:27 uh more theistic implications i have a
0:20:29 question and also darwinism is the most
0:20:30 simple sorry sorry
0:20:32 i know but
0:20:35 i have a question sorry do you know you
0:20:36 know that you were describing before
0:20:38 like
0:20:38 privately you haven't talked about the
0:20:40 process your view versus the gene
0:20:41 centered view right
0:20:43 and the process of views like that or
0:20:45 nature is a whole like
0:20:46 well old machine
0:20:50 it's a well-oiled uh
0:20:53 system right well because the machine is
0:20:55 one way right like for example let's
0:20:57 go back to this giraffe simple giraffe
0:20:59 example the the leaves are higher up
0:21:02 and then the giraffe extend its neck but
0:21:04 it wouldn't be able to extend this neck
0:21:05 unless the leaves were there right
0:21:06 yeah so so it's almost as if the ecology
0:21:09 or
0:21:10 the surrounding determines the outcomes
0:21:13 more so than the gene because
0:21:15 in the gene center interviews like is is
0:21:17 it more
0:21:18 driving force the genes driving force
0:21:20 than it is
0:21:21 the okay do you see what i'm asking yes
0:21:23 i yes i i see what you're saying
0:21:25 so okay very good question yeah sorry
0:21:28 yeah
0:21:33 the thing is the hair is is turning him
0:21:36 into a
0:21:36 sherlock holmes he's asking very
0:21:38 definitely okay what he's basically
0:21:40 saying
0:21:41 is yeah hijab is basically saying the
0:21:44 gene centered view
0:21:45 says we adapt to the environment
0:21:49 the precision view says or the other
0:21:52 view which is known as niche
0:21:53 construction says
0:21:54 we adapt the environment to our needs is
0:21:57 that is that interchangeable processor
0:21:59 uh well it can be relationship
0:22:03 it can be because you see with the gene
0:22:06 centered view
0:22:06 it it's um it's like a one-way thing but
0:22:10 the processional view is like a feedback
0:22:11 loop
0:22:12 right so everything flows now the good
0:22:14 thing here the
0:22:15 very interesting thing here in answer to
0:22:17 your question
0:22:18 yeah is darwinis will tell us it's about
0:22:23 uh selection it's about the selfish view
0:22:26 which is genes determine organisms
0:22:29 organisms
0:22:29 then uh determine societies and it's
0:22:31 like one way
0:22:33 however and we adapt to the environment
0:22:36 yeah so the environment is fixed
0:22:40 or not fixed or it's forcing us to
0:22:42 change right right
0:22:44 interestingly what we've discovered here
0:22:47 for for some time now is human beings
0:22:50 and other organisms rather than
0:22:53 adapting to the environment we adapt the
0:22:56 environment to us
0:22:57 for example beavers they build dams or
0:23:00 humans
0:23:01 yes it's cold outside rather than you
0:23:04 know
0:23:04 adapting to the environment we adapt the
0:23:06 environment to us so we start
0:23:08 building a house we start building
0:23:09 tables having heating so what you're
0:23:11 saying is very it's a very interesting
0:23:13 point and yes
0:23:14 this is a huge thorn in the side of
0:23:16 darwinism i want to say something else
0:23:18 as well um
0:23:18 tell me where you think where you stand
0:23:19 on this i was really the devil's
0:23:21 delusion by their they were balinsky
0:23:22 some time ago
0:23:24 i'm gonna i'm gonna have to give up my
0:23:25 channel because hijab
0:23:28 and then this is actually hopefully an
0:23:30 answer your question but i'm gonna ask
0:23:31 him
0:23:32 can i ask you right right so he's
0:23:34 actually clear from him on youtube
0:23:35 talking about this but he makes similar
0:23:37 arguments in his book devil's illusion
0:23:38 where he talks about the transformation
0:23:40 and to be crude obviously we're not
0:23:41 talking about a cow and a whale but he
0:23:43 talks about transformation of a
0:23:45 like a mammal a land mammal like a cow
0:23:48 to
0:23:48 a whale yep and he he asked this
0:23:50 beautiful question what the way he puts
0:23:52 it is
0:23:53 i'm not if you haven't and if anyone
0:23:56 hasn't seen it
0:23:56 go and check this out his name is david
0:23:58 belinsky and the way he talks about the
0:23:59 cow i don't know if it's on youtube or
0:24:00 something
0:24:01 but it's so powerful it requires a
0:24:02 reaction video between you
0:24:04 [Music]
0:24:05 on your channel but basically he says
0:24:08 that how many transformations
0:24:10 need to be made from a cow to become a
0:24:12 whale
0:24:13 like let's just think about it is it he
0:24:15 asked the question he goes ten thousand
0:24:16 twenty thousand fifty thousand
0:24:17 how many transformations right and then
0:24:20 and then it goes back to i think what
0:24:21 you were saying about this whole plane
0:24:22 and changing the engine in mid-air and
0:24:24 so on like that
0:24:25 it's gotta be movements so much because
0:24:27 obviously constraints yeah the
0:24:28 constraints but
0:24:29 here's the constraint issue becomes even
0:24:31 more pronounced when we're talking about
0:24:32 moving from lung to guilt
0:24:33 yes now think about that for a second
0:24:35 when i first thought about that
0:24:37 it really made me think the amount of
0:24:39 faith that these baloneys have yeah yeah
0:24:41 because you you believe that a cow
0:24:44 now to put it really crudely right can
0:24:47 or cowl-like creature can
0:24:49 eventually evolve to become like a
0:24:50 well-liked creature yeah and there's
0:24:52 many mutations that happened how many of
0:24:55 them have
0:24:56 happened a million a billion whatever it
0:24:58 may be
0:24:59 but we have to believe that that happens
0:25:01 a and b
0:25:02 that happens in the world that you
0:25:04 suggested so we're talking about the the
0:25:05 the plane moving
0:25:06 yeah in midair but the energy
0:25:10 yeah so that exactly is a perfect
0:25:12 analogy for the
0:25:13 the cow um sorry whale trap i love the
0:25:16 way you say cows
0:25:17 the cow will transition right now it's
0:25:19 really powerful because
0:25:20 the thing is when the dominus if you
0:25:23 call them that
0:25:23 i'm not sure if that's what they would
0:25:25 be called mandarinists
0:25:27 people like richard dawkins uh or his
0:25:31 people of his ilk sometimes they are
0:25:33 skeptical
0:25:35 skeptics yeah if that i don't see how
0:25:38 you can be a darwinian skeptic
0:25:39 by the way i see that as a contradiction
0:25:41 i really do because if you're if you're
0:25:43 a skeptic
0:25:44 what i've just described sounds a lot
0:25:46 like religion
0:25:47 yes like i don't care who tells me that
0:25:49 you're telling me a cow transformed into
0:25:51 a whale or you you know
0:25:57 as somebody who's open to the idea of
0:26:00 theistic evolution
0:26:02 right directed
0:26:05 that would be a possibility but
0:26:08 undirected
0:26:21 and even like i had the podcast with
0:26:23 he's like you know uh
0:26:24 oh yes yes yeah and he was saying like
0:26:26 animal revolution we believe in a
0:26:28 specific
0:26:28 you know the thing that we don't believe
0:26:30 is that adam evolved
0:26:32 but the other thing but even with that i
0:26:34 think the caveat
0:26:35 is yes we're open to it not yet
0:26:38 exactly right exactly thank you very
0:26:39 much uh i hope i like i hope this isn't
0:26:42 like off topic or anything right yeah
0:26:44 i when i was uh speaking to brother
0:26:45 shabir yesterday a lot of people in the
0:26:47 comments were saying that this
0:26:48 the question i asked was uh like more
0:26:51 something i should ask you
0:26:52 um and the question was basically
0:26:56 when they talk about abiogenesis right
0:26:58 or i guess the emergence of life
0:27:00 then like when they have when they have
0:27:02 day to day you know they draw
0:27:04 conclusions
0:27:04 interpret the data and etc but i guess
0:27:07 the question is why
0:27:09 they always tend to say okay well
0:27:11 abiogenesis
0:27:12 it doesn't matter when we talk about
0:27:14 evolution but shabir says
0:27:15 you have to start you have to go to the
0:27:17 start point
0:27:19 and figure out how it even began to know
0:27:20 how it continues so
0:27:22 if you're good you know if you consider
0:27:25 so basically saying i don't know if
0:27:26 you're aware of this website but it's
0:27:27 like this origins website
0:27:29 and there's like this uh phd's name is
0:27:32 what was his name i think uh something
0:27:34 like douglas theobold or something like
0:27:35 that
0:27:36 and he posted he like published this one
0:27:38 article like 29 evidences from a
0:27:40 microevolution
0:27:42 and then shabir was saying that you know
0:27:45 the evidence is like being interpreted
0:27:46 in a way
0:27:47 you know that isn't like necessarily the
0:27:48 way it should be interpreted
0:27:51 so the thing is again it goes back to
0:27:53 methodological naturalism yeah
0:27:55 so abiogenesis is something
0:28:00 something which if somebody really wants
0:28:03 to know
0:28:04 just how could you live with the final
0:28:06 question oh sorry sorry
0:28:08 so you see darwinian evolution
0:28:12 speaks about the development of life
0:28:15 yeah but before development you've got
0:28:17 to have origin yeah so from the moving
0:28:19 from chemistry to violence yeah
0:28:20 exactly exactly now the problem is like
0:28:24 you said brother eden
0:28:25 you cut you've got to have both as a
0:28:27 package yeah because if you're going to
0:28:29 say there's one origin
0:28:32 and that one origin is linked to the
0:28:34 unlikelihood
0:28:35 of chemical evolution but if chemical
0:28:37 evolution
0:28:38 is much more likelier then you'll have
0:28:41 multiple evolutions
0:28:42 and so in multiple origins if you have
0:28:43 multiple origins that
0:28:45 totally is like a bull in the china shop
0:28:48 of the people who come up with the
0:28:49 genealogical tree
0:28:51 because they will be like that's exactly
0:28:53 what paul nelson was saying he's saying
0:28:55 if you have more than one origin wow
0:28:57 which by the way for doolittle and carl
0:28:59 wolves and others who are atheists by
0:29:00 the way believers
0:29:02 they believe that the tree of life is
0:29:03 redundant really uh
0:29:05 and uh when it comes to uh tree of life
0:29:08 everything goes back to the scene yeah
0:29:09 yeah luca last universal commonance said
0:29:11 they don't believe in that
0:29:13 and um the three domains of life
0:29:16 one of them was discovered by uh carl
0:29:18 was i mean these are big big people
0:29:20 long story short their whole
0:29:23 idea of chemical evolution and
0:29:26 going from the inorganic to organic if
0:29:29 you look at all of the models there's a
0:29:30 guy called james tall
0:29:33 he absolutely demolishes these ideas
0:29:35 right however you have to understand
0:29:37 they still believe in them
0:29:39 and they have to believe in them simply
0:29:41 because of mythological naturalism
0:29:43 now darwin himself and i want everyone
0:29:45 to recognize this here
0:29:46 darwin himself he believed
0:29:50 that the origin should have been
0:29:53 something very very
0:29:54 simple the cell would be something very
0:29:56 like
0:29:57 like a jelly very simple right it turned
0:30:00 out to be much more complex
0:30:02 then in fact it was a that's why michael
0:30:05 b he gave the example of the black box
0:30:07 you open it up and it's like a mega city
0:30:09 yeah
0:30:10 so later other darwinists like francis
0:30:13 crick
0:30:14 they started coming up in their dna yeah
0:30:17 yeah exactly he discovered the structure
0:30:19 of dna and he anyone
0:30:23 so he he tried to solve that by saying
0:30:26 well maybe panspermia can explain it
0:30:31 panspermia being that life was sent down
0:30:34 to earth
0:30:35 uh with from rocky with rockets
0:30:38 and from an advanced civilization where
0:30:41 did the advanced civilization come from
0:30:43 richard rogers was asked this because he
0:30:45 also flirted with the idea of panzer
0:30:47 and he said maybe they evolved so the
0:30:49 thing is look
0:30:50 you can't win if methodological
0:30:53 naturalism what we can do is
0:30:55 point out they have methodological
0:30:56 naturalism right
0:30:58 and it's kind of like this so you
0:31:00 brought a circularity isn't it you can't
0:31:01 prove it with it
0:31:03 it's a circularity if they say it's not
0:31:05 an assumption
0:31:06 if this is an assumption we can leave
0:31:07 them alone so for example
0:31:09 if i have a debate with you brother eden
0:31:12 and we have the debate
0:31:13 based upon you have to show me where in
0:31:17 the bible jesus says he's not god
0:31:19 well you're not allowed to say the bible
0:31:20 is not reliable you're not allowed to
0:31:22 use the quran you're not allowed to use
0:31:23 logic
0:31:24 you're going to lose that debate because
0:31:25 no matter what you say i'll always go
0:31:27 back to something else
0:31:28 so we've limited all the options so when
0:31:30 you accept methodological naturalism
0:31:33 then you are always going to have
0:31:35 darwinism winning regardless of how many
0:31:37 just those stories or this or that
0:31:39 that's why
0:31:41 you can never tackle darwinism using
0:31:43 science salon
0:31:44 you can never do that you always have to
0:31:46 go back to the philosophy of science
0:31:49 um dr uh nielsen right or nelson i don't
0:31:52 know how to pronounce that
0:31:54 but does he have what's his position on
0:31:56 this i'm guessing he doesn't necessarily
0:31:58 believe in
0:31:59 darwinism right uh he he's an
0:32:02 uh intelligent design proponent so he
0:32:04 challenges darwinism
0:32:05 darwinism but he's an atheist or uh paul
0:32:08 nelson is a christian
0:32:10 oh he's a christian okay yeah that makes
0:32:12 that make sense yeah and also i want to
0:32:14 just say by the way
0:32:15 uh i know hijab loves
0:32:19 uh to use policies against atheists so
0:32:21 he's gonna love the
0:32:23 uh love this particular analogy right so
0:32:27 these guys
0:32:29 uh whenever they come out like uh uh
0:32:32 to challenge people like nelson and
0:32:34 others uh
0:32:35 atheists they come and say we can't take
0:32:37 these people seriously
0:32:39 they believe in god they're christian
0:32:41 right
0:32:43 but the thing is that's actually
0:32:46 the uh what did i call it again
0:32:49 uh the true scotsman fallacy yeah so for
0:32:52 example
0:32:53 the true scotsman is the fallacy that
0:32:57 true scotsmen eat oats
0:33:00 uh sorry true scotsmen don't put sugar
0:33:02 in their oats
0:33:03 and then someone says yeah but tom he's
0:33:06 a true scotsman and he puts sugar in his
0:33:08 nose
0:33:08 no no but he he's not a real
0:33:11 scotsman like they'll just keep changing
0:33:15 what they're uh we're looking for people
0:33:17 that are atheists and
0:33:18 like i mentioned david no there is there
0:33:20 is but here's the problem
0:33:22 if if they are going to if the atheists
0:33:26 are going to discount
0:33:28 theists because they're almost like the
0:33:31 genetics
0:33:31 okay yeah yeah then we can turn around
0:33:35 to the
0:33:35 group and say we're not going to take
0:33:36 you seriously because you're atheists
0:33:37 anyway
0:33:38 what's good for the goose is good for
0:33:40 the ganter so
0:33:41 what what's the point what's the point
0:33:44 of actually using this
0:33:48 what's the point of having this uh thing
0:33:52 about um oh these people believe in god
0:33:54 or their christians or their
0:33:56 intelligence
0:33:57 so we can't turn them seriously um break
0:34:00 in there
0:34:04 but if someone does break in it's going
0:34:06 to be a live stream and then
0:34:08 hijab with the stick
0:34:11 sure the most fun thing i think the
0:34:12 thing is right i find it very
0:34:14 hypocritical because
0:34:16 you know like every atheist that i've
0:34:17 come across has somehow said that
0:34:19 you know people that believe in god
0:34:21 always always like subscribe to you know
0:34:22 god of the gaps
0:34:24 but yeah i i always see atheists you
0:34:26 know
0:34:27 i mean they basically always put a label
0:34:30 to a mystery
0:34:31 because yes for example i'll just i
0:34:34 don't know if this
0:34:35 is a good example but the random
0:34:36 mutations right right i mean
0:34:38 they're saying it's random but it's just
0:34:40 like you don't have an onsen then you're
0:34:41 just calling it randomness
0:34:44 so i don't know i find it very
0:34:46 hypocritical and no
0:34:47 it is it is it it's it's the darwinism
0:34:50 of the gaps
0:34:51 um but what i do want to do brother uh
0:34:54 brothers
0:34:58 and father games the player inshallah
0:35:00 we're going to bring you on as well uh
0:35:02 and uh we're gonna i just realized that
0:35:04 and there's a lot more people waiting
0:35:07 i really apologize no no no no it's not
0:35:10 it's not actually your
0:35:11 your your questions were bringing out
0:35:13 information which was stuck
0:35:15 somewhere deep in here and it really
0:35:17 kicked off some uh
0:35:19 some activity in my brain but yeah i
0:35:21 thought it was really interesting
0:35:22 speaking to
0:35:23 brother eden thank you so much join us
0:35:26 again inshallah
0:35:27 yeah uh i just want to say that you know
0:35:29 i really you know i mentioned this like
0:35:30 last time but i really like appreciate
0:35:32 so much what your brothers do because
0:35:34 you know the more i listen to you the
0:35:35 more i actually realize you know but
0:35:37 especially about you know evolution this
0:35:39 isn't really adding up and you know when
0:35:41 they when you hear like the standard
0:35:42 narrative it really does confuse people
0:35:43 and you know etcetera so
0:35:45 yeah you know may allah bless all you
0:35:47 know both of you and your families
0:35:57 how are you doing
0:36:01 yeah i i i can't hear you you
0:36:05 you're very low my friend
0:36:08 you're very low i can't hear you brother
0:36:12 what on earth is that we can't hear you
0:36:16 brother
0:36:18 uh okay let's go to earth
0:36:22 there's some audio issues with brother
0:36:24 umar earth how are you doing
0:36:26 today
0:36:31 okay let's go to mahdi raza
0:36:35 brother mahdi can you unmute your mic
0:36:38 you're talking but your mics
0:36:40 your mics uh muted it's okay now
0:36:44 yes
0:36:50 brother hijab
0:36:54 where are you calling from i am calling
0:36:57 from lahore in pakistan
0:37:00 mashaallah brilliant lahore
0:37:04 lahore model town the heart of lahore
0:37:06 have you heard of lums
0:37:08 yup the oxford of pakistan
0:37:12 it's the oxford of pakistan and hijab
0:37:14 actually has a talk coming up in lums
0:37:16 what is that going on
0:37:17 when is that again he's not been
0:37:20 checking
0:37:24 okay by the way i did that as a as a
0:37:27 subtle reminder for him to check his
0:37:30 commitments but yeah i know his
0:37:33 no don't worry yeah um
0:37:37 i like his uh talks on political
0:37:39 philosophy as well
0:37:40 yes yes and he's going to be uh speaking
0:37:43 about feminism
0:37:44 at uh alums religious society inshallah
0:37:54 okay sorry
0:37:58 the feminists are gonna be finished yes
0:38:02 yes well if they're finished then you
0:38:04 say london
0:38:07 if they're not finished then you say
0:38:09 isabella
0:38:12 anyway so what's your what's your
0:38:13 question brother matthew
0:38:16 my question is uh that
0:38:21 i want to basically ask is can the
0:38:25 scientific arguments in the quran
0:38:28 or let's just say in abrahamic faiths
0:38:33 be used to counter or at least
0:38:36 show the reality of god to atheists
0:38:41 or non-believers or me so atheist
0:38:45 in that in that regard
0:38:48 i think that you know we have to have a
0:38:49 sophisticated approach with it and
0:38:51 um one of the important things i think
0:38:54 that that was now catching on to
0:38:56 is the the changing nature of science
0:38:59 that science changes
0:39:00 okay and this is people don't realize
0:39:02 that even what is referred to as
0:39:04 scientific fact can change
0:39:06 uh the dow the way it was being done in
0:39:08 the last 20 or 30 years
0:39:10 didn't account for this very important
0:39:12 fact
0:39:13 that what is referred to as scientific
0:39:16 act that can change
0:39:17 someone can say well this is a
0:39:19 scientific fact it won't change but
0:39:20 actually
0:39:21 there are things which are referred to
0:39:23 as scientific facts which will change
0:39:25 so we can't put forward the idea that
0:39:28 there's no
0:39:29 scientific fact in the there's no verse
0:39:32 in the quran or hadith that goes against
0:39:34 the scientific fact because
0:39:36 if it's a a scientific fact is defined
0:39:38 as something which doesn't change
0:39:40 uh something which can change then
0:39:42 there's no requirement for that to be
0:39:44 the case
0:39:45 like that's the first thing things which
0:39:48 are observable sometimes
0:39:49 have a higher epistemic value like for
0:39:51 example
0:39:52 if you look at the human being um
0:39:56 and the fact that you know very
0:39:57 straightforward reality that the human
0:39:59 being has
0:40:00 eyes or something like this or the fact
0:40:02 that if i hold
0:40:04 this phone and i drop it it will if i
0:40:07 let go of it or drop
0:40:09 these things will not change but now the
0:40:11 way i describe how that happens will
0:40:13 change so for instance theories of
0:40:14 gravity will change depending on
0:40:16 which time we're in which epoch we're in
0:40:18 so we have to be sophisticated with this
0:40:21 what i think is the best way to kind of
0:40:24 elaborate this
0:40:25 is to say that the quran has a unique
0:40:28 multi-dimensional way of dealing with
0:40:32 uh naturalistic phenomena so when it
0:40:34 talks about nature for example
0:40:35 naturalistic phenomena
0:40:37 it does it does it in a way which people
0:40:40 in the 7th century all the way through
0:40:41 to the 21st century can understand
0:40:43 and can can correlate it with a model
0:40:45 that they
0:40:46 have okay they can correlate with a
0:40:48 model that they have
0:40:50 and so obviously from that perspective
0:40:52 there
0:40:53 there's currency there we would say that
0:40:55 the quran from all the ancient religions
0:40:57 or
0:40:58 comparative to them has the best
0:41:00 propensity to do so
0:41:02 so for example if we look at the old
0:41:03 testament the argument can easily be
0:41:05 made
0:41:06 that the authorship is stuck in the
0:41:08 epoch of whatever it is
0:41:09 century that the old testament was
0:41:11 written or codified
0:41:13 but the quran seems to speak in ways
0:41:15 which go beyond
0:41:16 the seventh century narrative and i
0:41:18 think the best um
0:41:20 example of this is embryology like when
0:41:22 people talk about embryology in the
0:41:23 science of miracle i wouldn't put it in
0:41:24 that language
0:41:25 but i think when we talk about
0:41:27 embryology right in the quran and the
0:41:29 sunnah
0:41:30 it can easily be conceived in a way
0:41:33 which is concurrent
0:41:34 with modern biological understandings
0:41:37 and with
0:41:38 like the medieval understandings of the
0:41:40 seventh century for example
0:41:41 and all that which is in between so from
0:41:44 that perspective the quran seems to have
0:41:45 more of a propensity to speak to people
0:41:47 in different epochs
0:41:49 um when it comes to naturalistic
0:41:51 phenomena and i think that we have to be
0:41:53 we have to couch our language in
0:41:56 language of sophistication
0:41:57 and nuance rather than couching the
0:42:00 language with
0:42:01 certainties and scientific miracles and
0:42:02 this and i think that's
0:42:04 really academically it doesn't it
0:42:06 doesn't stack up the argument will not
0:42:07 be as
0:42:08 uh as potent so from that angle i think
0:42:11 the multi-dimensional uh
0:42:13 view you know is very good and you can
0:42:15 use a few examples and i like to use a
0:42:17 few examples like
0:42:18 as i've just mentioned some of the
0:42:19 things in the embryological corpus when
0:42:21 it comes to islam
0:42:22 you know easily can be understood but
0:42:25 like for example
0:42:26 i just filmed the video this week
0:42:28 there's a very famous hadith
0:42:30 which people have been understanding
0:42:31 incorrectly which talks about
0:42:33 either if the if the man's fluid
0:42:36 dominates the woman's fluid then the
0:42:39 appearance will be
0:42:40 according to that and if the woman's
0:42:42 fluid you know
0:42:44 dominates et cetera then the appearance
0:42:45 will be more of the mother people have
0:42:47 translated this as if the woman
0:42:48 ejaculates first well that's not the
0:42:50 correct translation because the word for
0:42:52 ejaculation is
0:42:53 right and that's not mentioned in that
0:42:55 and any of the alpha hadith any of the
0:42:57 language of the hadith the word that's
0:42:59 mentioned which is
0:43:01 he says this is the right uh is the word
0:43:04 which is in the quran chapter 23 verse
0:43:07 number
0:43:07 1
0:43:14 so if there was more than one god they
0:43:15 would have tried to dominate each other
0:43:17 so here
0:43:17 this hadith is talking about fluids
0:43:19 dominating one another
0:43:21 now we speak in the 21st century in
0:43:23 language of dominant genes dominant and
0:43:24 recessive genes
0:43:26 it's very easy to correlate this hadith
0:43:28 with that very extremely easily
0:43:29 especially when you have another hadith
0:43:31 which talks about you know the prophet
0:43:33 muhammad
0:43:34 he's talking to a man i'm not somebody
0:43:37 but there was a man who came who's
0:43:39 unnamed actually in the hadith
0:43:40 um and he had a black son he had a black
0:43:43 son
0:43:45 and then you know the black son you know
0:43:47 obviously
0:43:48 he's not black himself and his wife is
0:43:49 not like otherwise this would have been
0:43:50 strange for him
0:43:51 he said how could that be the case that
0:43:53 he has a blacks you know i've got a
0:43:54 black son
0:43:55 and then the prophet saws he said to him
0:43:56 look have you got camels he said yeah
0:43:58 what color the cows is red
0:43:59 he said do you have gray camels he said
0:44:01 yeah he said how comes he says
0:44:03 it could be because of some kind of
0:44:05 ancestral lineage
0:44:07 and the process
0:44:11 he said maybe it's because your son is
0:44:13 also the ancestral
0:44:14 illinois so here you have this idea of
0:44:17 um
0:44:17 recessive genes in modern parlance which
0:44:20 are
0:44:21 kind of um represented somewhere on the
0:44:24 lineage of the family of the person like
0:44:26 for example i'm six four six months with
0:44:27 that i'm not six foot six now another
0:44:28 one
0:44:29 anywhere close to that but some great
0:44:31 granddad might have been six foot
0:44:32 six or six or seven and then i might
0:44:34 have had the tool g in the weather's
0:44:35 passed down it could be you studying the
0:44:37 marxism yeah yeah or to the
0:44:39 australia playing for a basketball
0:44:41 something another life
0:44:42 but whatever it is right the point the
0:44:44 point is is that when you put all these
0:44:46 hadiths together it's easy
0:44:48 it's easy to conclude okay well this is
0:44:50 understandable from up from our modern
0:44:52 perspective
0:44:52 for instance another hadith beautiful
0:44:54 easy simple
0:44:58 okay the born child
0:45:01 is not from the entirety of the fluid
0:45:03 simple hadith
0:45:05 simple hadith there's no miss it's clear
0:45:08 right
0:45:08 that's why children resemble their
0:45:10 mothers as well
0:45:12 yeah children can resemble their mothers
0:45:14 it's not because
0:45:16 the misunderstanding is that oh because
0:45:17 she ejaculates first no no one
0:45:19 is saying that it's talking about allah
0:45:21 it's talking about domination so the
0:45:23 the fluid has some components within it
0:45:25 which dominate components within our
0:45:27 fluid and we know it's a mixture of the
0:45:28 fluids because
0:45:29 it's not in
0:45:37 you know we have created the human being
0:45:38 from a mixture of fluids um
0:45:40 so that we may test him who made him
0:45:42 hearing and seeing so
0:45:43 you have this mixture of fluids and it's
0:45:46 not the entirety of the fluid which
0:45:48 which the child is from because we know
0:45:49 it's on one cell from each
0:45:51 for the fertilization to take place we
0:45:53 can actually put all of that in
0:45:55 in sequential form and it can make sense
0:45:57 to a 21st century audience
0:45:59 without having to do uh hermeneutical
0:46:01 acrobatics or something like that but it
0:46:03 would have made sense
0:46:03 for the people in the 7th century that's
0:46:05 a really nice word
0:46:06 you know what i mean so it's and that's
0:46:08 what we believe the multidimensional
0:46:10 thing is
0:46:10 is that look even if you wanted to
0:46:13 subject it to our current kind of
0:46:14 observable understandings
0:46:16 it wouldn't be uh ridiculous to do
0:46:18 something like
0:46:20 it's we can understand this i had these
0:46:21 in light of 21st century understandings
0:46:24 but what a seventh century person would
0:46:26 have understood it in their own way and
0:46:27 that would have been fine for them as
0:46:28 well and that's the beauty and the
0:46:29 miracle there
0:46:30 in the multi-dimensional timeless nature
0:46:32 of the quranic discourse when it relates
0:46:34 to natural
0:46:35 naturalism not because of some kind of
0:46:37 false
0:46:38 um requirement a false requirement for
0:46:41 all of the verses of nature the quran to
0:46:43 match with whatever model that they have
0:46:45 of the day this is
0:46:46 this is not the requirement
0:46:50 for joining us today hopefully that
0:46:52 answers your question and inshallah
0:46:54 you're going to see hijab
0:46:56 at lums university we don't know when
0:46:59 inshallah yeah i'll find out the time
0:47:01 but i'm pretty sure inshallah he'll be
0:47:03 ruffling some feathers
0:47:06 [Music]
0:47:10 [Laughter]
0:47:14 [Music]
0:47:19 can you hear me
0:47:32 my question for you for your brothers is
0:47:34 that how can i pursue my interest for
0:47:36 philosophy as a muslim living in the
0:47:38 west
0:47:39 i really like the subject but don't know
0:47:42 whether i should even pursue it in the
0:47:43 first place and how i should do it
0:47:45 also i would love some book
0:47:46 recommendations zakalov
0:47:50 okay so just can you go
0:47:53 can you first feedback feedback
0:47:58 okay so so thank you for asking the
0:47:59 question
0:48:03 that firstly muslims do things in the
0:48:06 right order
0:48:07 so if you start you know if you start
0:48:10 something and you do
0:48:11 the good the right things but you do
0:48:13 them in the wrong order
0:48:14 you're just going to cause yourself
0:48:15 issues so let's look at a few things
0:48:17 firstly there's no such thing as
0:48:18 philosophy
0:48:20 yeah when it comes to you
0:48:23 studying at western universities you're
0:48:26 not studying philosophy
0:48:27 you're actually studying western
0:48:29 skepticism which is labels philosophy
0:48:32 when you go to say the islamic tradition
0:48:35 you'll be studying islamic epistemology
0:48:38 and they'll call it islamic philosophy
0:48:40 so what's happened is it's kind of like
0:48:42 this yeah you know
0:48:44 hoover can you hoover the room yeah
0:48:46 hoover is actually a brand
0:48:48 but it's so successful that hoover and
0:48:50 vacuum cleaner is
0:48:52 uh synonymous now yeah in the same way
0:48:56 western skepticism and that epis
0:48:59 that epistemology is so prevalent in the
0:49:02 world
0:49:03 that it's just called philosophy in fact
0:49:05 just to add to this um
0:49:06 i was reading something quite recently
0:49:08 that and i know it's not the same as
0:49:09 western skepticism but i was
0:49:11 i was reading that almost all philosophy
0:49:14 departments in almost all um
0:49:16 western universities describe themselves
0:49:18 as analytic
0:49:20 philosophical departments they all refer
0:49:22 to themselves in that sense
0:49:23 so people have to realize that when
0:49:24 they're going into it in the west
0:49:27 it's a very specific uh school of
0:49:30 thought
0:49:30 and we're talking about this as well
0:49:31 like if if you're talking about the west
0:49:33 then
0:49:34 if you go and do a search on the 20 most
0:49:37 top 20 university of the uk for example
0:49:39 yeah and most philosophers in those
0:49:41 departments
0:49:42 are going to be philosophers of uh the
0:49:44 mind either conscious studying
0:49:46 consciousness or something like this
0:49:47 they're going to be phrases of science
0:49:49 philosophers of science is quite as
0:49:50 popping nowadays
0:49:52 um so it's a consciousness mind
0:49:55 more sorry philosophy of science and
0:49:57 then you've got a lot of philosophers
0:49:59 that deal with ethics and and those
0:50:01 kinds of things yeah these i reckon
0:50:02 these three subjects are what dominate
0:50:05 philosophy departments yeah and
0:50:06 obviously they're gonna they're gonna
0:50:07 employ a lot of
0:50:08 western things obviously they do have
0:50:10 i'm not saying that like they don't have
0:50:11 um
0:50:12 islamic philosophers and so but it's not
0:50:14 that many in the west
0:50:15 yeah it's not that many yeah and the
0:50:17 other thing is that
0:50:18 when because what you're basically doing
0:50:20 is you're entering into a field you're
0:50:23 entering into a
0:50:25 a a world
0:50:28 in which you're not prepared to actually
0:50:30 answer that western skepticism
0:50:32 and this is why i'm not in favor of
0:50:35 saying to muslims yeah you could just go
0:50:36 study philosophy
0:50:37 i don't think that's a good idea hamza
0:50:39 actually has a really good
0:50:42 video on this somewhere online where he
0:50:44 talks about
0:50:45 well firstly have you studied islamic
0:50:47 epistemology islamic
0:50:49 either no then what's the point of doing
0:50:51 something when you go
0:50:52 you won't know how to challenge it you
0:50:54 won't know how to uh
0:50:56 you know uh take honest assumptions
0:50:58 secondly
0:50:59 what's the purpose what are you trying
0:51:01 to achieve what what is the end goal is
0:51:03 it just you know
0:51:04 okay i like this or is it actually okay
0:51:07 i want to
0:51:08 do dal with it this particular focus
0:51:10 thirdly do you have somebody who's
0:51:12 grounded in
0:51:13 western philosophy and grounded in islam
0:51:15 that can help you in case you come
0:51:16 across
0:51:17 things that you can't solve because i
0:51:19 think it's extremely important when
0:51:20 muslims
0:51:21 need to do first is study what islam
0:51:25 says what our epistemology is what our
0:51:27 philosophy is
0:51:28 before they study philosophy under the
0:51:30 guise of western skeptic
0:51:32 western skepticism in the guise of
0:51:34 philosophy because that can lead to
0:51:36 serious issues and there's people who i
0:51:39 mean a basic book
0:51:41 is um gone to any good islamic bookstore
0:51:45 get the explanation of imam tahavi's
0:51:47 book that's just basic but even within
0:51:50 that you'll get the islamic
0:51:51 philosophical paradigm
0:51:52 which shows that we begin with the fitra
0:51:54 we don't begin with the assumption
0:51:56 there's no god and then try to come to
0:51:57 it rather
0:51:59 we actually see that the signs of allah
0:52:01 reinforces us within
0:52:03 and muslim and muslim philosophers and
0:52:05 muslim thinkers
0:52:06 our paradigm and our foundational first
0:52:08 assumptions are different to the western
0:52:10 philosophers
0:52:11 so it's extremely important that we
0:52:12 don't fall into the uh
0:52:14 like if if a western
0:52:17 young man grew up in the muslim world
0:52:20 and then studied
0:52:21 the islamic philosophical tradition
0:52:23 they'd definitely be inclined to that
0:52:25 even though they're western person
0:52:27 in the same way when you get a muslim
0:52:28 who doesn't know islamic philosophy
0:52:30 but they grow up and then they study the
0:52:32 western tradition they'll be
0:52:33 okay that's the only paradigm right but
0:52:36 remember
0:52:37 and look i just want to give you guys
0:52:38 something extremely important here to
0:52:41 understand
0:52:42 philosophy today simply means western
0:52:44 skepticism it doesn't mean philosophy
0:52:46 itself
0:52:47 i'm going to give you one solid piece of
0:52:49 evidence for this yeah
0:52:51 knowledge was defined by aristotle
0:52:55 as um true justified belief
0:53:00 so justify true belief anything that was
0:53:02 justified
0:53:03 that was true that someone believed that
0:53:05 means they had
0:53:06 knowledge okay that's the definition
0:53:10 now that was well accepted for at least
0:53:13 two thousand years
0:53:14 edmund getty came uh around in the 1960s
0:53:18 and he showed how this was wrong
0:53:21 you could actually come up with these
0:53:23 things called gettier cases where
0:53:24 somebody believes something
0:53:26 they know something and it's justified
0:53:29 but it's
0:53:30 not they don't have knowledge right but
0:53:33 even though this was a big thing in the
0:53:34 western world 1960s we discovered
0:53:37 that's not true justified belief the
0:53:39 people who actually discovered that true
0:53:41 justified belief is not knowledge
0:53:44 goes back to the indus civilization over
0:53:47 a thousand years ago
0:53:49 so those philosophers from the indus
0:53:51 valley civilization
0:53:53 they came to this realization but this
0:53:55 wasn't transposed into the the western
0:53:57 tradition
0:53:58 so again you know this blanket thing
0:54:01 should i just go study philosophy
0:54:02 no i don't think it's a good idea and i
0:54:05 think definitely hijab wants to add some
0:54:06 i want to add that so that
0:54:07 you know you've got to think about
0:54:08 before you study anything in life
0:54:10 i want to actually bring this back to
0:54:12 the quran and there was a verse i was
0:54:14 just reading the other day and i
0:54:16 um i was thinking about it and it really
0:54:19 illuminated
0:54:21 my own perspective on on studying
0:54:43 yeah this is a verse that it says
0:54:47 it's not for the believers to go out and
0:54:49 fighting
0:54:50 altogether okay and this this next part
0:54:53 here is really interesting because it
0:54:54 got me confused the arabic got me a
0:54:56 little bit confused and i
0:54:57 started looking at tafasir and stuff
0:54:58 like that it says if all of them went
0:55:01 out altogether
0:55:02 and there was not a group of them that
0:55:04 go out and learn the religion
0:55:07 okay so that they can go back to their
0:55:09 people and
0:55:10 tell uh and um warn them
0:55:14 like
0:55:17 so they may be warned the question is
0:55:19 who are the people
0:55:21 that allah is talking about in this
0:55:23 verse is it the people that are going to
0:55:25 do jihad with the propheth
0:55:28 is it saying that there should be a
0:55:29 group of people left behind so that they
0:55:31 don't get killed in jihad
0:55:32 so that if jihad yani happens
0:55:36 there's some people that can still learn
0:55:38 and teach their religion to their people
0:55:40 the majority of mufasa's to my surprise
0:55:43 said it was actually the the people who
0:55:47 are going
0:55:48 with the prophet sallallahu alaihi
0:55:49 sallam that are being referred to as
0:55:53 the ones who are going to learn about
0:55:54 the religion right and
0:55:56 this like when i was doing my own
0:55:58 brought me something really beautiful
0:56:00 well that's amazing i might make like an
0:56:02 instagram post on it or something like
0:56:04 that
0:56:04 which is this the best knowledge
0:56:08 is practical knowledge and you know what
0:56:10 this the thumbnail of this a or the
0:56:12 fruit from this a is that why because
0:56:15 allah says
0:56:18 the ones who are going out according to
0:56:20 this which is the majority opinion the
0:56:22 ones who are going out with the prophet
0:56:23 are the ones who are referred to as the
0:56:26 ones who are
0:56:27 learning about the religion okay
0:56:32 and that they may warn their people when
0:56:34 they come back to them so that they may
0:56:35 be warned
0:56:37 but of course so the the question is
0:56:39 you'd it's
0:56:40 a bit of a surprise it's
0:56:41 counterintuitive because you think
0:56:43 learning happens in a classroom it
0:56:44 happens when someone is explaining to
0:56:45 you these things and
0:56:47 all these um whiteboards and you know
0:56:50 lectures and whatever but the prophet
0:56:52 sorry allah is telling us that true
0:56:54 learning happens in practice
0:56:57 yeah yeah because look you're going out
0:56:58 with the prophet you're going to see how
0:57:00 he acts
0:57:01 in the jihad he's going to be talking
0:57:02 about the rulings he's going to be
0:57:04 giving you that
0:57:05 hands-on knowledge the best knowledge is
0:57:08 practical knowledge
0:57:09 after knowledge about allah that's the
0:57:11 best knowledge you have to know that you
0:57:13 can't go
0:57:13 it will be a shame for a muslim it will
0:57:16 be a shame for a muslim to try and
0:57:17 approach a book of philosophy
0:57:18 and they haven't even looked at the
0:57:20 quran for example there's such a
0:57:21 beautiful
0:57:22 one and the second thing sorry just
0:57:23 before i forget
0:57:25 the second thing is after this essential
0:57:28 knowledge
0:57:29 okay the thing after right after that is
0:57:32 practical knowledge so now we've got to
0:57:33 think about what you want to do
0:57:34 objective you have to be objective
0:57:36 orientated right what are your
0:57:38 objectives are you want to come out and
0:57:39 do that one
0:57:40 you want to come out and do down in the
0:57:41 west you want to come and are you living
0:57:43 in another park because i know there's
0:57:44 pakistan is watching this
0:57:45 or whatever are you in the middle east
0:57:48 are you in arab
0:57:49 you want to do that one in in the
0:57:50 arabian world do you want to do doubt to
0:57:51 muslims you want to do that to
0:57:52 non-muslims
0:57:55 once you've established your objective
0:57:59 now we can start talking about what
0:58:00 should we study okay okay
0:58:01 and definitely and i just i just
0:58:04 remembered a really beautiful point two
0:58:05 beautiful points actually
0:58:07 shaykh abdul rahim green mentioned yes
0:58:09 there's a brother a few years ago
0:58:11 who was very much like you know he was
0:58:13 very impressed by
0:58:14 the sword sees he's very impressed by
0:58:16 your science and talk
0:58:18 [Laughter]
0:58:20 yes young ones
0:58:23 so um this particular brother he said to
0:58:26 shaykh karim that
0:58:28 what should i study like i want to do
0:58:29 dawah i want to do this i'm going to do
0:58:31 this
0:58:32 you know he's all about what what books
0:58:34 in terms of
0:58:35 science philosophy i remember you know
0:58:37 that like every everyone i mean a lot of
0:58:39 people
0:58:39 are like this now and uh sheik green
0:58:42 said to him
0:58:44 read the quran finish it
0:58:48 and then read it again and when you
0:58:51 finish it
0:58:53 read it again and you know what
0:58:56 i honestly think that was the best
0:58:58 advice because the quran has
0:59:00 its own philosophy it has its own
0:59:04 paradigm it has its own epistemology
0:59:07 and once that's indoctrinated within you
0:59:10 and it's exactly what hijab said
0:59:12 about transformative knowledge yeah so
0:59:16 there is things in the quran which do
0:59:19 not make sense
0:59:20 until you ponder upon them think
0:59:23 about them apply them then
0:59:26 it becomes part of you so how would you
0:59:28 leave this ocean of knowledge and then
0:59:30 go to a little pond
0:59:31 where you can't even have a tadpole
0:59:34 living thank you
0:59:36 and it's disease with mosquitoes let me
0:59:38 tell you something right
0:59:40 this is very important like what i was
0:59:41 doing i did like a politics degree
0:59:43 and i focused on political philosophy
0:59:44 yeah which is not and i've done theories
0:59:46 of the self and consciousness but that
0:59:48 was not my focus my focus was political
0:59:49 philosophy
0:59:50 for my undergraduate but at the same
0:59:52 time i was studying islam
0:59:54 at the same time i was memorizing the
0:59:55 quran at the same time when i was
0:59:56 memorizing the quran
0:59:58 i understood what i was saying i was
1:00:00 protected by the quran and i was
1:00:02 protected by allah
1:00:04 i think it's we would say in arabic it's
1:00:06 rude it's kind of like
1:00:07 disrespectful for you to go
1:00:11 and immerse yourself in philosophy yeah
1:00:14 and
1:00:14 you're not even focusing on what because
1:00:17 if philosophy is
1:00:18 wise sayings western skepticism yeah
1:00:20 which is that
1:00:21 why sayings of the people and you
1:00:23 haven't even you don't even
1:00:24 know what the most wise has said to you
1:00:26 that's disrespectful man that's
1:00:28 you start with the quran you start with
1:00:29 that once you at least
1:00:32 it's kind of like me making a video
1:00:34 about feminism
1:00:36 and deleting muhammad jab's uh
1:00:39 comments yeah honestly it it it
1:00:42 it makes perfect sense allah is the
1:00:44 authority lies all wise allah messengers
1:00:47 and then what do we do we go to okay for
1:00:49 example what's the name of that guy who
1:00:51 talks about
1:00:52 time the greek philosopher senecas okay
1:00:56 right
1:00:56 yeah he's talking about time and people
1:00:58 are sharing his stuff about time
1:01:00 and he talks about how life is so short
1:01:02 and you get old and you die
1:01:04 most people they spend their life uh not
1:01:07 being fulfilled
1:01:08 are you always or is he yeah yeah yeah
1:01:11 in that vein yeah
1:01:12 anyway when i was thinking about this
1:01:13 because this video is about this muslims
1:01:15 getting impressed other people get
1:01:16 impressed yeah
1:01:17 i thought so yeah
1:01:20 but but instead instead and this is the
1:01:22 thing which is very powerful
1:01:24 yeah why seneca's saying what is tony
1:01:27 robbins today
1:01:28 saying what is zig zagler these people
1:01:30 thousands of years ago and today alive
1:01:32 today like tony robbins
1:01:34 what they're saying if you're gonna be
1:01:35 successful in life think about death
1:01:38 because death is going to create urgency
1:01:40 it's going to do this it's going to do
1:01:41 that well guess what
1:01:42 bro they're half true they're half true
1:01:44 because the messenger of allah yeah he
1:01:46 said the same thing
1:01:47 except he gave you a direction and these
1:01:50 guys don't give you just like martin
1:01:51 hyde
1:01:52 yeah the same thing yeah he said go and
1:01:53 visit the graves i think it was some
1:01:54 revolution but everyone was talking
1:01:55 about
1:01:56 this they they did half the thing
1:02:00 they said they created the urgency but
1:02:03 they didn't give you the direction the
1:02:04 messenger of allah creates the
1:02:06 urgency and then tells you what prepare
1:02:09 for the hereafter
1:02:10 so the wisdom of the prophet sallam if
1:02:13 anything
1:02:13 the the crumbs that fall off his table
1:02:16 they you know that flow away into the
1:02:19 scene and some some people just picked
1:02:21 that up and
1:02:21 we're very impressed honestly i'll be
1:02:23 very very honest with you guys
1:02:25 i spend a lot of my time just
1:02:28 watching and reading and doing this type
1:02:30 of stuff about uh
1:02:32 philosophical ideas and i did that for
1:02:33 many many years and then i started to
1:02:35 realize do you know what
1:02:36 all of these things are i literally do
1:02:39 not know of
1:02:40 any piece of knowledge which is
1:02:42 interesting
1:02:43 or sophisticated except allah's
1:02:45 messenger already mentioned it for
1:02:47 example yes i'm about to say something
1:02:48 yeah beautiful god
1:02:49 uh beautiful here i hope yeah um
1:02:53 what does allah teach us
1:02:56 about allah's messenger teach us about
1:02:59 zinna
1:03:00 very interesting concept yeah allah's
1:03:02 messenger
1:03:04 rather than simply saying to the young
1:03:06 man who came to him he said he wants to
1:03:07 commit
1:03:08 rather than saying to him no that's
1:03:11 haram
1:03:12 or if you do that you're going to get
1:03:13 flogged he said to him how do you like
1:03:15 someone to do that to
1:03:17 your mother or your sister or your
1:03:19 daughter
1:03:20 now um there's a book called
1:03:24 change and it's all about how you change
1:03:26 and how to make change and all of this
1:03:29 and it gives this powerful analogy and
1:03:30 this book went viral
1:03:32 people are writing like blogs about it
1:03:34 videos about it online you'll see
1:03:36 change and audios and all this stuff
1:03:39 what does the guy say
1:03:40 he basically says we human beings are
1:03:43 made up of three things
1:03:45 right we have an elephant on top of the
1:03:47 elephant we have a rider
1:03:48 and then we have the path the path is
1:03:50 our environment
1:03:52 the rider is our intelligence and the
1:03:55 elephant
1:03:56 is our emotions the rider
1:03:59 if he wants to go forward and the
1:04:01 emotions
1:04:02 want to the elephant wants to go that
1:04:04 way the rider will win
1:04:06 for five minutes and then five hours
1:04:08 they'll be going in the wrong direction
1:04:10 environment and the intelligence they
1:04:12 played the least roles the greatest is
1:04:15 emotion what did the messenger of allah
1:04:17 do he didn't give he didn't go to his
1:04:19 intellect and say
1:04:20 it's wrong he didn't say get away from
1:04:22 the woman alone
1:04:24 although those are valid too he said how
1:04:26 would you like someone to do that to
1:04:27 your mother how would you like someone
1:04:28 to do that to your children
1:04:30 he changed his state and and
1:04:33 tony robbins what did he talk about
1:04:34 state change yeah and what does
1:04:36 and what does tony robbins say check
1:04:38 this out he says three things he says
1:04:40 and this guy is everywhere he's given
1:04:42 advice to bill clinton
1:04:45 didn't take in some regards
1:04:49 uh this is uh after watershed time so we
1:04:51 could talk about this stuff young things
1:04:53 um so anyway young ones untrained ones
1:04:57 so uh what was i saying yeah so what did
1:04:59 he talk about check this out
1:05:01 he says to change your state you need
1:05:03 three things
1:05:04 focus language and physiology
1:05:09 you need to focus on something you need
1:05:11 to say something
1:05:13 and you need to change your physiology
1:05:16 that's the salah allah you focus
1:05:20 you say and you change your stay and
1:05:22 what does the messenger of allah say
1:05:24 when you're angry
1:05:25 sit down if you're sitting down lie down
1:05:29 tell me something that these guys are
1:05:30 coming up with today which the messenger
1:05:32 allah can i just add to this one more
1:05:34 thing just just to kind of really answer
1:05:36 that question because this is a very
1:05:37 common question that's why i want to
1:05:38 give it justice
1:05:40 look when it comes the first thing i
1:05:42 said or
1:05:43 trying to give advice on this is you
1:05:44 have to be goal oriented in life in
1:05:46 general right
1:05:48 if you're not goal oriented and you're
1:05:50 not objective orientated you will be a
1:05:52 failure
1:05:53 just please take that advice from me i'm
1:05:54 not um
1:05:57 i don't want this to go over anyone's
1:05:58 head it's if you don't know what your
1:06:00 goals are for the next five or ten years
1:06:02 you're going to be a failure in life
1:06:04 you're going to let life take control of
1:06:05 you
1:06:06 life is going to be like a horse that's
1:06:07 running with you rather than you're
1:06:09 directing it right like that that's
1:06:11 what's going to happen
1:06:12 that's number one so you've got to think
1:06:14 about what do you want what contribution
1:06:15 do you want to make
1:06:16 so the first thing going back to the
1:06:17 verse because we want to make this a
1:06:18 quranic answer
1:06:20 when you're studying generally the first
1:06:22 objective should be
1:06:23 yet so that you know about the religion
1:06:29 that you get the ignorance of the
1:06:31 religion away from you
1:06:32 and then number two is
1:06:35 so you can go and help and benefit the
1:06:37 other people there's two things that we
1:06:38 should want
1:06:39 i'm telling you what your objective
1:06:41 should be number one not to be ignorant
1:06:43 because being ignorant is not as good
1:06:58 and ranks those of you who have been
1:07:00 given iman and the ones who who have
1:07:02 been sorry
1:07:02 believe and who have um uh been
1:07:06 given knowledge in ranks so the first
1:07:08 thing is
1:07:09 to get rid of the the the hell and then
1:07:12 to benefit the other people if if you
1:07:14 have to study philosophy
1:07:16 you have to have a prerequisite in
1:07:18 islamic
1:07:19 you have to have some understanding at
1:07:21 least a grounding in the quran
1:07:22 some understanding in basics of islam
1:07:25 you have had to
1:07:26 have been doing some talable island for
1:07:28 at least five years in my opinion
1:07:30 for you to understand what the what
1:07:32 allah is trying to say to you first
1:07:33 because it's
1:07:34 number one at this respect if you want
1:07:36 to go to the direction of the
1:07:37 philosophers who are giving you these
1:07:38 wise sayings
1:07:40 and the most wise is giving you
1:07:41 information and knowledge and nasiha
1:07:44 and you're going to other people first
1:07:45 that is the hugest is i cannot imagine
1:07:48 of a bigger that is converging on coffer
1:07:50 i believe verging on kufrin jail
1:07:52 and ignorance but if you're doing it
1:07:54 because you want to now if you're a p
1:07:56 your your objectives have changed the
1:07:57 reason why you're studying philosophy
1:07:59 it's not because you want to know about
1:08:01 the world and all this is like your
1:08:02 blank slate tabula rasa and you want to
1:08:04 be filled up
1:08:05 no that's not your intention your
1:08:06 intention is to go there
1:08:08 and you want to find you you want to be
1:08:11 grounded on the knowledge
1:08:12 that you need to protect your family and
1:08:15 your community
1:08:16 okay you need to learn political
1:08:17 philosophy you need to learn the
1:08:18 philosophy of science you need to learn
1:08:20 philosophical biology
1:08:21 you need to learn about this and that
1:08:22 you need to learn about those things
1:08:24 and you don't need to learn about it
1:08:26 more than you need to learn about it if
1:08:28 you're going to just do it
1:08:29 relegate it to your your own kids in
1:08:30 your own community whatever like
1:08:32 you don't need to become an island in it
1:08:33 you don't need to have a phd in it but
1:08:35 at the same time now we do need some
1:08:36 people in the ummah who do
1:08:38 have phd work on these fields so that
1:08:40 they can represent us as muslims
1:08:41 intellectually
1:08:42 and so it depends on what your
1:08:44 objectives are if you want you want to
1:08:45 represent muslims
1:08:47 okay you want to represent the muslim
1:08:48 community intellectually
1:08:50 you have to train yourself first and
1:08:52 foremost in the religion of islam
1:08:53 because it will be a big
1:08:55 big uh disrespect to to allah the
1:08:59 messenger for you to start with
1:09:00 philosophy and
1:09:01 relegate that and then you can choose a
1:09:04 subfield
1:09:05 and stick to your objectives and in five
1:09:07 or ten years you'll have something that
1:09:08 you
1:09:09 that you will change your life and
1:09:10 change other people's lives and
1:09:11 absolutely absolutely
1:09:12 um and one thing i just wanted to add
1:09:14 about this
1:09:16 is if you as a a
1:09:20 believer if you as a muslim you're more
1:09:23 attracted to
1:09:24 these subjects than you are to the quran
1:09:27 and the sunnah
1:09:29 i know i mean you giving thou as the
1:09:31 least of the lord yeah exactly
1:09:33 there is a serious serious issue it
1:09:35 actually makes me a little bit uh angry
1:09:37 look i i'll tell you i'll tell you
1:09:38 something about uh uh
1:09:40 muhammad jabba i was remembering the
1:09:41 other day yeah so when muhammad wasn't
1:09:43 muhammad hijab he was
1:09:44 education that's what i knew in fact my
1:09:46 phone still had him saved as
1:09:48 education yeah okay he came and he said
1:09:50 oh uh
1:09:51 he he wanted to speak to him about
1:09:53 something about uh
1:09:54 darwinism right so i said okay fine um
1:09:57 sat in the office
1:09:58 this is 2015 or 16. yeah iran
1:10:02 so anyway i went over david stove and
1:10:05 what shocked me
1:10:06 well actually he knew a lot but what
1:10:08 other
1:10:09 what what surprised me he didn't talk
1:10:11 about evolution
1:10:12 but then when he did talk about it he
1:10:15 learned more and then he spoke about it
1:10:18 so
1:10:18 he didn't just okay let me just learn a
1:10:20 little bit and maybe just chuck it out
1:10:21 there
1:10:22 like what's what's surprising even today
1:10:24 is that he's been reading belinsky he's
1:10:25 been reading this and that
1:10:27 but again it's about and look
1:10:29 alhamdulillah i mean i'm older than
1:10:31 hijab
1:10:32 but the first time not the look of it i
1:10:34 i
1:10:35 gave a a talk on feminism
1:10:38 i did not put it out until hijab checked
1:10:40 the slides
1:10:41 remember i was in pakistan i think this
1:10:43 lights and i got his book
1:10:45 even though i'd been reading up about
1:10:47 feminism for a while
1:10:48 so the thing is it's not just oh you
1:10:51 know you want to be
1:10:52 like you know you know focus on the
1:10:53 topic you want to be
1:10:55 you know better than others or whatever
1:10:57 it's okay there's a need
1:10:58 i would never talk about feminism the
1:11:00 only reason i started my feminism is
1:11:01 because
1:11:02 feminism was correlating with darwinism
1:11:04 and there was a conflict
1:11:06 yeah there was a there was a dovetailing
1:11:08 of objectives of showing how
1:11:10 both of these things are actually wrong
1:11:13 and and so
1:11:14 exactly like i've said if there's people
1:11:15 already out there doing that great stuff
1:11:18 you don't need to go out there and okay
1:11:19 i want to study this
1:11:21 every muslim i truly believe every
1:11:23 muslim if they
1:11:25 really thought about priorities and
1:11:27 what's going to benefit them
1:11:29 they'd be talking to us about okay like
1:11:32 which quran course did you
1:11:33 do how did you do this how did you do
1:11:35 that and i think through your debates
1:11:37 through hamza's debates through the
1:11:38 works that's been happening
1:11:40 a negative byproduct can be
1:11:43 that people think you have to start with
1:11:44 philosophical ideas people think you
1:11:46 have to start with this
1:11:47 you have to start with explaining why
1:11:49 you can have intercourse with a dog
1:11:52 right like that's the starting point of
1:11:53 our epistemology yeah
1:11:55 well you're right and that's like at the
1:11:57 end of the day
1:11:59 yeah i really feel like there's people
1:12:01 in the dao that know the bible
1:12:03 quran and that just makes me sick that's
1:12:05 all i can say about that
1:12:07 that that actually makes me sick there's
1:12:08 no there's no justification for that
1:12:11 there's some people that memorize more
1:12:13 verses from the bible than they have
1:12:14 from the quran
1:12:16 and that just it shows a lack of
1:12:17 sincerity that's all i say
1:12:19 i see that as a lack of sincerity
1:12:21 because if you really wanted to
1:12:22 to change communities how can you the
1:12:24 quran says
1:12:31 with the quran but you had this with the
1:12:32 quran how are you going to do jihad
1:12:34 it's like you have a bow and arrow every
1:12:36 sword of the quran is like
1:12:37 an arrow and you have the bow but you
1:12:40 want to go out there
1:12:41 putting some you know redundant material
1:12:45 in the bow to try and
1:12:46 shoot out that the strongest thing you
1:12:48 have is the quran and if you want to be
1:12:50 representative for muslims
1:12:51 if you cannot repre if you cannot defend
1:12:54 the book of allah
1:12:55 and you you don't even know what people
1:12:57 are talking about when they're talking
1:12:58 about certain verses
1:13:00 then that is ridiculous
1:13:04 i've just made a mistake uh and the
1:13:06 mistake i've made
1:13:07 is not interacting enough with the
1:13:08 audience so i'm gonna go i'm gonna go to
1:13:11 uh fuddly games the player please ask a
1:13:15 question and sorry for keeping you
1:13:16 waiting
1:13:17 and i'm going to post the link for
1:13:18 anybody else one thing is that the
1:13:19 reason why you did that
1:13:20 is because this question is one of the
1:13:22 most common questions absolutely
1:13:24 so it was worth it
1:13:28 hello assalamu alaikum yeah can you hear
1:13:31 me
1:13:32 yes we can brother how are you doing i'm
1:13:34 doing good how you guys doing
1:13:37 are you from the states yeah from
1:13:39 michigan
1:13:40 marshall i can tell by the accent what's
1:13:43 your
1:13:45 i have uh question two questions but the
1:13:47 first one is about um
1:13:49 i've seen you guys video on when you
1:13:51 because a lot of
1:13:52 uh on the apes how you people say that
1:13:55 some people say that oh we started from
1:13:57 apes but a question i have is um
1:14:01 if they say that we started we came from
1:14:03 apes why they're still monkeys
1:14:05 that they're still there like they
1:14:06 haven't evolved they're still monkeys
1:14:08 so yeah yeah the thing is just to
1:14:11 correct
1:14:12 something here the darwinists did then
1:14:15 don't
1:14:15 say that we came from apes they say that
1:14:18 we have a common ancestor
1:14:20 with apes yeah now i'm i'm just gonna
1:14:24 and your question is very good but i'm
1:14:27 gonna answer in a bit of a
1:14:29 uh a bit of a way which looks like a
1:14:32 distraction but it's not
1:14:33 and it's actually a thought experiment
1:14:34 yeah so me and hijab here
1:14:37 what we're gonna do is we're gonna go in
1:14:40 a time machine
1:14:41 and we're going to go back 2 000 years
1:14:43 to bethlehem
1:14:45 we're going to go back to bethlehem and
1:14:47 we're going to take from the royal
1:14:48 society in london
1:14:49 the best biologists that they can access
1:14:52 the best scientists we're going to take
1:14:54 a team of 50.
1:14:56 and with the 50 plus us 252 we end up in
1:14:59 bethlehem 2000 years
1:15:01 back using a time machine we get off
1:15:04 now we know it's bethlehem and we know
1:15:07 that isa islam is here and we know that
1:15:09 mariam al-islam is here
1:15:10 but the scientists don't know anything
1:15:13 they just come with us and then what we
1:15:14 do is
1:15:15 we tell them where the directors we tell
1:15:17 them can you do a dna analysis of
1:15:20 everybody
1:15:20 and tell us who's related to who so
1:15:22 they're going to take out
1:15:24 the dna of all of the people in
1:15:26 bethlehem
1:15:27 they're also going to take out the dna
1:15:28 who islam who they're going to take out
1:15:30 the dna of marijuana
1:15:32 then they're going to make a chart and
1:15:33 they're going to give a presentation
1:15:35 they're going to say okay guys
1:15:36 you commissioned us to take out the dna
1:15:38 of everybody
1:15:40 right in bethlehem and to make a
1:15:41 genealogical tree
1:15:43 this is the tree that we've built and me
1:15:45 and hijab will sit there
1:15:46 and we will say okay this man jesus of
1:15:49 nazareth is his mother they're going to
1:15:51 say
1:15:52 this woman mary and then we're going to
1:15:54 say okay who's the father
1:15:56 they're going to say this person person
1:15:58 x who's most likely to be somebody
1:16:00 closely related to mariam islam
1:16:03 we're going to say that's not the father
1:16:05 they're going to say
1:16:06 why not we're going to say because
1:16:10 he was born of a virgin because it's a
1:16:12 miracle they're going to say
1:16:13 no the dna sec sequences we can see
1:16:17 the closely related is the mother is
1:16:19 this closely related to the father is
1:16:21 this
1:16:22 yeah we'll say no no no it's a miracle
1:16:24 they say no it's not
1:16:26 no matter what scientific arguments we
1:16:28 give it'll never work that's right
1:16:29 what's happened is methodological
1:16:30 naturalism
1:16:31 has led to the conclusion miracles are
1:16:34 not possible
1:16:35 reproduction without male and female is
1:16:37 not possible
1:16:38 and therefore the mother is mary and the
1:16:41 father is this person even though that's
1:16:43 a false positive
1:16:44 so likewise in natural methodological
1:16:48 naturalism when applied to biology
1:16:50 that's right
1:16:51 when applied to human history they have
1:16:53 to link us to something else genetically
1:16:56 close to us
1:16:57 whichever primate now when we come along
1:16:59 and we say
1:17:00 like allah says in the quran adam is
1:17:02 like isa the light the similitude
1:17:04 we say there's an exception we say this
1:17:06 is supernatural
1:17:07 they cannot and mark my words a priori
1:17:11 meaning before observation the
1:17:12 scientists before they observe the
1:17:15 genomes
1:17:16 they had a belief which is
1:17:19 virgin birth is impossible male female
1:17:22 come together to
1:17:23 to put to uh have reproduction so
1:17:26 likewise
1:17:27 adam alayhi salam is a creation of allah
1:17:31 a miracle like isla islam
1:17:33 but those scientists will never accept
1:17:35 it because of methodological naturalism
1:17:37 hence why
1:17:38 there is no point and i think brother uh
1:17:41 fatherly the games i'm just emphasizing
1:17:43 there is no point challenging common
1:17:46 ancestry to humans in chimpanzees
1:17:48 or universal common ancestry or any of
1:17:50 these things using science alone
1:17:52 you have to go to the philosophy of
1:17:53 science you have to look at epistemic
1:17:55 weighing
1:17:56 why do we believe in the miracle of isa
1:17:59 alayhi salaam because allah said so
1:18:01 why do we believe in the miracle of adam
1:18:02 al-islam because allah said so
1:18:04 the same reason that the atheists deny
1:18:07 isa al-islam's virgin birth is the same
1:18:10 reason why they deny
1:18:11 adam and eve salaam's creation allah
1:18:15 i like it it makes sense i want to add
1:18:18 something to this
1:18:18 by the way this is from shaykh of the
1:18:20 rheem green it's not for myself of
1:18:21 course of course
1:18:22 it wouldn't be for myself it was so
1:18:23 great
1:18:25 um
1:18:29 you know there's a beautiful thing right
1:18:31 and this is what you're saying is in the
1:18:32 quran
1:18:32 okay so there's there's two verses i
1:18:34 want to bring which is that you know
1:18:36 the story of zakaria and this is
1:18:40 maryam yeah where zakaria
1:18:43 gave the glad tidings of this son
1:18:46 and then he said i've never named anyone
1:18:48 this and some say oh we can we know some
1:18:50 john's that will fall on the
1:18:51 baptist but allah says you know we we
1:18:54 haven't named we
1:18:55 he hasn't named him that could have been
1:18:57 some other person who named it that's
1:18:58 the difference
1:18:59 for a different day anyway the next
1:19:00 thing is
1:19:28 we have created you before that and you
1:19:30 are nothing so here the point is this is
1:19:32 that allah because even zakarey asked
1:19:34 this question because he was so used to
1:19:36 methodological necklaces
1:19:39 you know this is the idea like it's not
1:19:42 just
1:19:42 it's not a singular situation allah
1:19:46 mentions this many times in the quran
1:19:47 that's very interesting yeah
1:19:49 it's very interesting yeah okay this
1:19:50 situation here is uh the woman is not
1:19:52 giving
1:19:52 birth she's barren which is barren how
1:19:55 fertilization takes place you know all
1:19:57 these things that we're just talking
1:19:58 about the emotions
1:20:00 taking place how can you explain it's
1:20:02 inexplicable that you have this woman
1:20:04 that's going to be she's an old woman
1:20:05 like in age
1:20:07 and now she's going to be given birth
1:20:09 and so on and so allah is saying the
1:20:11 reason why
1:20:11 because and this is his reasoning in the
1:20:14 quran
1:20:15 the reason why it's easy for me number
1:20:17 one was justification
1:20:19 number two and we have created you
1:20:23 before
1:20:24 and you are nothing and what's really
1:20:25 important about this is that
1:20:27 it's physically true there was a time
1:20:29 where like 29 years ago
1:20:31 i wasn't i wasn't here like 30 years ago
1:20:32 i was here like i was 29 i'm 29 years
1:20:34 old
1:20:34 30 years ago i wasn't i wasn't in
1:20:36 existence there was nothing of me
1:20:39 there was nothing of me like i just did
1:20:41 not exist
1:20:42 so allah saying you are nothing and then
1:20:44 you became something
1:20:46 so why is it difficult to conceive of a
1:20:48 first human being
1:20:49 why does that happen because the
1:20:50 naturalist is always stuck in second
1:20:52 guess thinking
1:20:53 there must have been something before
1:20:54 the muslim god is saying no
1:20:56 if you if you take the premise that
1:20:58 there's this all-powerful sustainer god
1:21:00 you'd he can create you from nothing so
1:21:02 this becomes a completely it's a
1:21:04 non-sequitur that's it you know what i
1:21:06 really need to write paper on that
1:21:09 because allah
1:21:16 we have not let them see the creation of
1:21:19 the heaven and earth
1:21:20 and we have not let them see the
1:21:22 creation of themselves
1:21:24 we no one saw abiogenesis it's
1:21:25 unobservable phenomena
1:21:27 well the skeptic fool no i'm not talking
1:21:29 about the problem i'm talking about you
1:21:30 know obviously the
1:21:31 the skeptics saying oh you know this and
1:21:33 how could you not believe it
1:21:34 brother you have not seen this
1:21:36 phenomenon i've not seen it
1:21:38 in fact if anything you've seen the
1:21:39 opposite to it so
1:21:41 brother fuddly games the player may
1:21:43 allah bless you jazakallah for joining
1:21:45 us i'm going to go to
1:21:46 umar the egyptian or should i say
1:21:50 gibson
1:21:54 you know uh just before you um
1:21:57 what's it called uh speak i get mistaken
1:22:01 for egyptian people
1:22:02 for some reason like i've had people
1:22:04 come up to me and said are you egyptian
1:22:05 you should take that as the greatest
1:22:08 compliment
1:22:11 yeah so first of all i really respect uh
1:22:14 what you said about first learning the
1:22:16 islamic
1:22:18 ideas before going to philosophical
1:22:20 argument
1:22:21 i really respect that i was impressed by
1:22:23 that so uh
1:22:25 i have uh two questions i want to ask
1:22:28 about uh first of all
1:22:30 um so uh you know
1:22:33 uh how
1:22:36 um sorry i forgot my question um
1:22:43 let's say um you've got
1:22:46 someone believing that it's um
1:22:49 god is unjust because of uh
1:22:52 some let's say someone in the 18th
1:22:54 century living
1:22:56 some living somewhere like so far away
1:22:59 from any muslim country
1:23:00 they never heard of islam died early
1:23:03 they would say
1:23:04 how is allah just in in that
1:23:07 example so how do you argue is that
1:23:10 i'll give a short answer and i'll leave
1:23:12 hijab to give a long answer because i
1:23:14 need to pray isha and i'm pretty sure
1:23:15 he's prayed but i haven't prayed yet
1:23:17 so i'll give you a very short answer the
1:23:19 short answer is
1:23:21 you see when it comes to a question like
1:23:26 what okay here's a simple analogy
1:23:30 so i'm gonna
1:23:33 on the way back home tonight i'm going
1:23:35 to be getting a lift from muhammad's job
1:23:37 to my house
1:23:38 yeah now i can actually fall asleep
1:23:41 in the car i can i can be like okay he's
1:23:44 going to drop me off here
1:23:45 i'm not going to think to myself he's
1:23:47 going to drive up to yorkshire
1:23:49 and then take out a double browse shop
1:23:51 and then just just deal with me in the
1:23:53 field
1:23:54 i don't i don't have that lack of trust
1:23:56 like oh my god like
1:23:57 is he really trustworthy what if i fall
1:23:58 asleep and he's just like
1:24:00 you're coming
1:24:04 so and then later on i said i i i he
1:24:07 drops me off and then i say
1:24:08 alhamdulillah you dropped me off but you
1:24:10 know i had these doubts that you're
1:24:11 gonna take me yorkshire and
1:24:12 i think he's gonna be like bro like yeah
1:24:15 don't
1:24:16 trust me like yeah come on man i'm not
1:24:19 crazy so you know when we question
1:24:23 or when the atheist questions and says
1:24:26 what would god do with the orphan child
1:24:29 that was born in
1:24:30 you know a natural reserve and they were
1:24:32 away from islam
1:24:33 what about people who never heard of
1:24:35 islam they're doing the same thing
1:24:37 they're basically saying i have more
1:24:39 compassion than allah
1:24:41 allah i i'm doubtful what allah is going
1:24:44 to do
1:24:45 so i'm going to question allah and what
1:24:48 does allah say about the disbelievers
1:24:49 that disbelieves despair of allah's
1:24:51 mercy
1:24:51 the fact is this allah created
1:24:55 us as beings and we could have been
1:24:58 beings that were vicious
1:24:59 do you know that some sharks they kill
1:25:03 before they're born because in the womb
1:25:05 they kill their siblings
1:25:06 so before they enter the earth yes
1:25:09 before they
1:25:10 enter life before they're born they've
1:25:12 killed already
1:25:13 if allah wanted human beings could have
1:25:15 been that vicious but
1:25:16 allah sent down mercy
1:25:20 and a small part of it and he kept the
1:25:22 rest with himself
1:25:23 so this whole question you know what
1:25:26 would allah do
1:25:26 and look this is not a good ques this is
1:25:28 not a new question musa
1:25:32 what is musa saying musa saying the lord
1:25:35 of the east and the west
1:25:36 the lord of you and your forefathers and
1:25:38 every single time what was pharaoh
1:25:39 saying
1:25:40 didn't you kill a man didn't you do this
1:25:42 are you trying to spread corruption
1:25:44 curveballs and then when
1:25:47 musa islam saying something like calling
1:25:49 you to your lord
1:25:51 what lord of the worlds and look at this
1:25:53 and when musa islam is giving him
1:25:55 evidence and giving him proof and giving
1:25:57 an
1:25:57 argument what does he say yeah what
1:25:59 about people before me
1:26:00 yeah what about people before me meaning
1:26:02 fine you've given me evidence
1:26:04 what about people before me look at musa
1:26:06 islam's answer and this is the true
1:26:07 answer of a moment
1:26:09 what does he say my lord knows best
1:26:10 about them meaning
1:26:12 don't worry about them for on you don't
1:26:14 have more compassion than allah does you
1:26:16 have more noise than allah does allah
1:26:18 has given you evidence
1:26:20 don't you worry about the other people
1:26:21 allah created them and allah
1:26:23 it does not do injustice to anyone and
1:26:25 there's a narration of the prophet
1:26:27 sallam
1:26:28 the narration of the prophet which i'm
1:26:29 going to repeat
1:26:31 but i still need to find the uh
1:26:34 the the actual the grading of it but
1:26:37 it's something which i've heard a
1:26:39 a reputable scholar say and that scholar
1:26:41 has actually
1:26:42 verified that this is correct but i do
1:26:44 find it which i'm going to paraphrase
1:26:46 now but the meaning is totally correct
1:26:48 when people ask what will happen to the
1:26:51 children of the disbelievers
1:26:53 there'll be no hair in this one why
1:26:56 because ultimately what's happened is
1:26:58 they're not trusting allah anymore you
1:27:00 know
1:27:01 you should be able to just say if you
1:27:04 truly i'm not talking about you i'm just
1:27:06 people who ask the question or atheist
1:27:08 if you truly believe in allah
1:27:10 you don't ever need to ask what is going
1:27:13 to happen with these people
1:27:15 what's going to happen with those people
1:27:16 because ultimately allah
1:27:18 is any concern you have in your heart
1:27:20 can never be greater than
1:27:22 allah's concern for his own creation
1:27:25 subhanallah uh can i go
1:27:28 to my second question just i want to add
1:27:30 one
1:27:44 so this is them is that the answer like
1:27:47 for
1:27:47 in terms of who these people that have
1:27:50 not heard the message and stuff they'll
1:27:51 be given a specific
1:27:53 message on the day of judgement if even
1:27:55 if they heard a distorted type of
1:27:56 message
1:27:57 they will be given because it's not the
1:27:59 message then if it's if it's a
1:28:00 distortion
1:28:01 uh then they'll be given uh a specific
1:28:04 test on the day of judgment
1:28:06 uh so we can't say for sure that these
1:28:08 people are gonna be eternally abiding in
1:28:09 hell
1:28:10 uh if especially if they haven't if they
1:28:12 haven't been
1:28:13 given exposure to um to the to the
1:28:16 message does that answer the question
1:28:18 yeah thank you um going to my second
1:28:21 question
1:28:22 how do you make it so when i look
1:28:26 from my perspective when i for example i
1:28:28 look at a
1:28:29 paganistic belief or a paganistic
1:28:31 tradition
1:28:33 i i i feel it's very uh foreign for me i
1:28:36 look and say wow they're so
1:28:38 superstitious
1:28:39 how would someone believe in that so if
1:28:41 i look uh into a point of view
1:28:43 of an ace atheist i think they would do
1:28:46 this
1:28:47 the same thing to islam or any other
1:28:50 abrahamic religion
1:28:51 so how do you how do would you make
1:28:54 islam so
1:28:55 it's not uh so foreign to to
1:28:59 to an atheist i think the main thing is
1:29:01 like
1:29:02 the thing is that we will surely
1:29:11 show them our science in the horizons
1:29:14 and
1:29:14 in themselves until they are sure that
1:29:17 it's the truth
1:29:19 now if you really ponder over this verse
1:29:22 and bear in mind that human beings live
1:29:25 for
1:29:26 on average 60 70 80 years that's a long
1:29:29 time
1:29:29 in the in in the grand scheme of things
1:29:31 like annie it's it's not like you have
1:29:33 three or four days to make a decision
1:29:36 and uh you don't know what you're trying
1:29:38 scurrying along trying to find that
1:29:40 you're not finding it love's gonna burn
1:29:41 you too late it doesn't work like this
1:29:43 like it's it's a very natural thing to
1:29:46 ask
1:29:47 why am i here what am i doing here
1:29:48 what's my purpose and it just
1:29:51 boggles the mind that there can be
1:29:52 people that live entire lifetimes
1:29:55 going to work eating food watching
1:29:57 netflix or whatever it is
1:29:59 watching youtube watching all these
1:30:00 instagram stuff
1:30:02 doing sports uh procreating having
1:30:05 intercourse
1:30:06 having multiple sexual partners going
1:30:08 clubbing going this place
1:30:09 but all of this one question which is
1:30:12 the most
1:30:13 elementary and basic question
1:30:16 like do i have a purpose um is there a
1:30:18 reason for me being here
1:30:20 how did i get here where am i going all
1:30:22 of these straightforward questions
1:30:24 that people don't take the time to
1:30:26 answer that like even if you go on
1:30:27 youtube now and see the fad diets that
1:30:29 there are
1:30:30 ketogenic diet paleogenic diet this diet
1:30:33 the the
1:30:34 dolce diet i don't know all these kinds
1:30:35 of diets people are concerned about
1:30:37 their health because they see the
1:30:38 immediate
1:30:40 result for that people are concerned
1:30:42 about
1:30:43 uh their knowledge they want to get a
1:30:45 degree they wanna they're concerned
1:30:46 about their careers they wanna make
1:30:48 money
1:30:49 why would they not be concerned about
1:30:51 the most important thing of all
1:30:52 which is purpose and so it's it just
1:30:55 boggles the mind that creatures that are
1:30:57 so directed towards
1:30:58 purpose would deliberately
1:31:02 malign their own natural intuitive
1:31:05 movement towards it by all of these
1:31:07 distractions in life
1:31:09 all you need to do really is to get
1:31:11 yourself back orientated
1:31:13 and this is probably one of the best
1:31:14 things for mental health that's not
1:31:15 spoken about
1:31:17 by these psychologists western
1:31:18 psychologists is go to a graveyard
1:31:21 or look at someone being buried because
1:31:23 it will just
1:31:24 let you know and see this is gonna be
1:31:27 your demise man
1:31:28 and so before i get to that stage i need
1:31:30 to figure out what i'm doing here
1:31:32 where i'm going and what's going to
1:31:33 happen after i'm in this position
1:31:35 and for me i just feel like if someone
1:31:37 is sincere honestly if someone is
1:31:39 sincere to that purpose
1:31:41 they will be doing the exploration
1:31:43 they're going to check the
1:31:44 the christian religion the jewish
1:31:46 religion the muslim religion
1:31:48 the major world religion is going to be
1:31:49 accessible enough for them to be able to
1:31:51 check it
1:31:51 they're going to check it and make a a
1:31:54 kind of
1:31:54 conclusive value judgment on it
1:31:58 and islam is made in such a way or is
1:32:01 the corpus of islam is in such a way is
1:32:03 this is giving you falsification tests
1:32:06 you know
1:32:13 tests this test that test uh is it's
1:32:16 trying to get you to a point of
1:32:18 certainty on your purpose
1:32:20 so if you're if you're sincere i
1:32:22 genuinely believe if you're sincere you
1:32:23 arrive at this point well there's one
1:32:25 god one creator that god that created
1:32:27 everything that's in existence and me
1:32:28 and it created a purpose for me
1:32:30 and so on and so forth and there's a
1:32:31 there's a there is a something that
1:32:32 happens after death
1:32:34 if you get to that point then that's it
1:32:36 islam will give you the satisfaction
1:32:38 that you need on an intellectual level
1:32:39 on a rational level
1:32:40 on a spiritual level and all these
1:32:42 things but if someone is
1:32:44 is worried because uh something is
1:32:47 uh alien to their culture and stuff
1:32:50 they're not true seekers of
1:32:51 uh truth they're not they're not sincere
1:32:54 seekers of truth that's the reality of
1:32:56 the situation if someone is looking for
1:32:58 truth they don't care where it comes
1:32:59 from
1:33:00 that's the truth that's a general
1:33:02 principle if someone is
1:33:04 actively looking for the truth and they
1:33:06 are willing to follow it
1:33:08 even if it goes against country tribe
1:33:11 or whatever community they will find the
1:33:14 truth
1:33:14 they will find it seeketh the truth
1:33:18 and the truth uh as the bible says shall
1:33:20 set you free
1:33:21 but if you're not going to seek the
1:33:23 truth then
1:33:24 how are you going to be set free from it
1:33:27 so people have to think in these ways
1:33:29 man
1:33:32 yeah thank you very much yeah thank you
1:33:35 very much
1:33:36 not much bro i don't know how to manage
1:33:38 the
1:33:39 um yeah just call out their names oh
1:33:41 okay so who's who did we just have
1:33:42 we had omar the egyptian so just the
1:33:45 other name is
1:33:46 corsol yeah
1:34:03 pulling um i'm from down under you
1:34:08 close by
1:34:12 where where from underneath you don't
1:34:14 worry we're not
1:34:16 planning a coup or something from the
1:34:19 netherlands bro
1:34:20 netherlands yes sorry to hear that
1:34:24 what oh so
1:34:28 yes uh uh which city
1:34:33 russia rotterdam rotterdam
1:34:36 so uh what's it called wardham islam
1:34:39 world
1:34:39 islam yeah one muslim i'm a member from
1:34:42 them actually
1:34:42 you're one of the members yeah right you
1:34:45 still have that brother what's his name
1:34:47 um he's a turkish
1:34:51 fatih who's like the head of it right
1:34:54 uh abdullah
1:34:58 i don't remember his name but yeah we
1:35:00 went down there a few years ago
1:35:02 you guys are doing great work martial
1:35:05 you mean uh he's a turkish brother
1:35:09 he's also called he's the head
1:35:12 yeah he's it's the older man fifties
1:35:15 right something like that yeah yeah it's
1:35:16 uh you talk about ab
1:35:22 okay yeah give him my salam he's a
1:35:24 wonderful
1:35:25 inshallah when i see him you know during
1:35:28 the lockdowns we don't see
1:35:29 each other much i'll tell him inshallah
1:35:31 he he
1:35:33 he took us around rotterdam and we took
1:35:35 care of us marshall
1:35:36 oh so um don't mind to be rude but uh
1:35:42 i have actually two questions you know
1:35:44 two questions that uh come along quite
1:35:45 often
1:35:47 and i i don't see much content on and
1:35:50 i scroll the muslim internet and the
1:35:53 muslim
1:35:54 responses but i don't see anybody
1:35:56 responsing to these questions and
1:35:58 actually you know as a strategy with one
1:36:01 of muslim
1:36:02 actually encountering these questions a
1:36:04 lot
1:36:05 uh i also sometimes wander off to the
1:36:08 ats side of the internet to see what's
1:36:10 brewing under them
1:36:11 so what i've noticed is uh what's not
1:36:14 tackled is
1:36:14 the notion that we're living in a
1:36:16 simulation
1:36:18 this is one of the things that's
1:36:21 proposed and
1:36:22 propelled by the likes of joe rogan elon
1:36:25 musk
1:36:25 and uh george hearts you know big names
1:36:28 big programmers
1:36:30 uh these guys get worshiped by
1:36:33 almost all the atheists and they uh
1:36:36 really propel this
1:36:37 thought and it's not really tackled so
1:36:39 um
1:36:40 if you if it can be responded to in such
1:36:43 a short time i would like your response
1:36:45 if not
1:36:46 leave it off maybe make a video on it
1:36:49 with uh
1:36:50 research a hard problem of solipsism is
1:36:53 something that a
1:36:54 atheist is worth worst nightmare for
1:36:56 them right why would they
1:36:58 use most atheists are naturalists if
1:37:00 you're if you're now introducing
1:37:01 solipsism
1:37:02 which is the idea that you know your
1:37:04 brain in a vat you're not really how is
1:37:06 that helping your
1:37:07 naturalistic case you know that's in
1:37:09 fact if anything endangering it because
1:37:11 then you are going into like in
1:37:13 substance theory kind of like an
1:37:15 idealism if anything
1:37:16 rather than a dualism or materialism
1:37:18 it's actually against materialism
1:37:20 in many ways like hard problem of
1:37:22 solipsisms how do you know that you're
1:37:24 not
1:37:24 that this physical world is not all that
1:37:25 there is that's a stepping stone towards
1:37:28 the supernatural that's
1:37:29 one step away from religion or even if
1:37:31 you could argue that is religion
1:37:34 because we believe that it doesn't act
1:37:36 it doesn't act as an obstacle at all
1:37:38 from the islamic perspective if anything
1:37:40 it reinforces that because the islamic
1:37:42 perspective says that this is this world
1:37:44 is not everything that there is this
1:37:46 reality this
1:37:47 physical reality is not everything that
1:37:48 is when you die you're going to be in a
1:37:51 reality that is as real as this reality
1:37:53 but it's not this reality this is called
1:37:54 the hayat
1:37:56 the the higher of the bars he mentions
1:37:59 in his book and he talks about for
1:38:00 example the hayatu
1:38:02 the life of the guru and he talks about
1:38:05 the
1:38:06 the idea of enlargening and constricting
1:38:09 of the of the grave which is a hadith
1:38:11 which is very well known
1:38:12 and he says this is not to be understood
1:38:14 in this world in this dunya world
1:38:16 and this is obviously a disciple of
1:38:18 benthamia and he's a hard
1:38:20 if you want to call it that literalist
1:38:21 in the sense that he doesn't metaphorize
1:38:23 the text or whatever
1:38:24 and this is him saying that when you
1:38:26 when we're talking about constricting
1:38:28 the grave and or expanding it this is
1:38:30 actually not in the
1:38:31 physical grave that we have this is this
1:38:33 is a dunya that is or this is a reality
1:38:35 that is a completely different reality
1:38:36 and you are being subjected
1:38:38 to a completely different set of uh law
1:38:41 so for example when the
1:38:42 two angels come and ask you the three
1:38:44 questions and then literally as the
1:38:46 hadith says you're giving
1:38:47 you're given a window of either heaven
1:38:49 or hell you'll see your deeds in front
1:38:51 of you it's not happening
1:38:52 inside the grave in a physical sense
1:38:54 this is happening in a completely
1:38:55 different realm
1:38:56 and this realm is the height of which
1:38:58 the the soul actually goes to
1:39:00 when you're asleep when you're asleep
1:39:02 your soul goes to the bazaar
1:39:04 and this is the unconscious so when
1:39:06 you're unconscious in this world you're
1:39:07 conscious in the other world
1:39:09 this is this is a profound paradigm
1:39:11 shift and a reality change
1:39:13 so a solipsism and all those kinds of
1:39:15 things which these atheists
1:39:17 if they wanna yanny talk about that
1:39:18 first of all they have to realize
1:39:19 they're shooting themselves
1:39:21 in the foot if they're if they're
1:39:23 physicalists or
1:39:24 materialists number one number two this
1:39:26 if anything
1:39:27 if you want to go down that route and
1:39:29 it's true you can't actually solve the
1:39:30 hard problem of
1:39:31 solar you cannot refute it the hard
1:39:33 problem of solidism is irrefutable it's
1:39:34 just like
1:39:35 the hard problem of consciousness it's
1:39:37 an irrefutable proposition
1:39:39 but we don't need to refute it as
1:39:40 muslims we in fact believe in it
1:39:43 is it not a difference like if they pre
1:39:46 presuppose uh
1:39:47 this whole simulation like how i
1:39:50 thought about it like from first
1:39:52 principle perspective
1:39:54 it's not a natural thought so it doesn't
1:39:56 go on to death
1:39:57 sorry bro if it's this if if this world
1:40:00 is a simulation
1:40:01 like this this thing the matrix yeah
1:40:04 do you know the matrix have you watched
1:40:06 that i watched it when i was like year
1:40:07 old or something like that i don't watch
1:40:08 films no more
1:40:10 it's a waste of time but this matrix
1:40:11 thing where you put the thing in the
1:40:12 back and that means that what pill
1:40:13 you're going to take and whatever yeah
1:40:15 now let me tell you something if we
1:40:17 assume that this is a reality
1:40:19 that the matrix is a reality yeah this
1:40:22 do you know that that plug they put into
1:40:24 the person's head for example yeah
1:40:26 and then the person's in a different
1:40:27 reality now which is literally it's got
1:40:30 dimensions it's got physical properties
1:40:31 or it's got properties of some sort
1:40:33 it's it's got dimensions it's got um a
1:40:36 coherence it's a coherent place
1:40:39 right it's not a place of randomness
1:40:40 it's a coherent place
1:40:42 now you cut then the same exact
1:40:45 arguments that we're proposing to the
1:40:47 atheists
1:40:47 in this world can be applicable in that
1:40:49 world so how can you have a coherent
1:40:51 world
1:40:51 where there's uniformity of nature and
1:40:53 there is regularity
1:40:55 and who is who is in control of such uh
1:40:57 simulation
1:40:58 who has put it into place who is
1:41:00 maintaining that simulation
1:41:01 who is sustaining that or what is
1:41:03 sustaining that simulation
1:41:05 if an atheist does himself the
1:41:07 disservice
1:41:08 of actually positing uh solipsism or
1:41:12 some kind of obstacle
1:41:13 then that is him almost putting himself
1:41:16 in a grave
1:41:17 ready for you to put the shovel to the
1:41:19 to the mud and
1:41:20 bury him fully the solipsism in no
1:41:24 way shape or form acts as an obstacle to
1:41:28 the religious narratives it
1:41:29 it acts only as an obstacle to the
1:41:31 materialist physicalist narratives
1:41:33 of the of the age yeah and a point to um
1:41:35 add to this is something for us the
1:41:37 hobby said
1:41:38 on the live stream and i had him a few
1:41:39 days ago
1:41:41 is uh if you i mean if they make the
1:41:43 argument
1:41:45 we're in a simulation it's a very
1:41:47 subjective thing
1:41:48 when you say you're in a simulation
1:41:50 that's right but in order for us a
1:41:52 subjective
1:41:53 thing to exist there has to be an
1:41:55 objective
1:41:56 right the concept of in doesn't make
1:41:59 sense unless there's a out
1:42:01 right right so even if uh
1:42:04 there is uh that assumptionism says
1:42:07 essentially that the only thing that can
1:42:09 be known is the self right
1:42:11 and we could be a brain of that or
1:42:12 whatever yeah um
1:42:14 fine your brain in a vat but you still
1:42:16 exist exactly
1:42:17 so some things something subjective and
1:42:20 something is objective
1:42:22 and if i mean the for us gives the
1:42:24 example of dreams right
1:42:25 so you're in a dream you think it's real
1:42:27 then you wake up and you're like oh that
1:42:29 was a dream but how do you know which
1:42:30 which one's the dream which is
1:42:31 but it doesn't make a difference yeah
1:42:33 because one's objective one's subjective
1:42:35 and um they i mean it's kind of like
1:42:38 this yeah
1:42:39 it's it's it's an
1:42:42 intellectual ego massage the way that
1:42:45 they use it oh it's just in a simulation
1:42:47 elon musk says it elon musk says oh
1:42:49 we're going to be in the moon in five
1:42:50 years and you know it's just
1:42:52 it's just one of those things you say
1:42:53 but when you actually think about it
1:42:55 it makes no real difference even if it
1:42:57 was true that's fine i agree with you
1:42:59 it's it's not an it's not a natural
1:43:01 thought
1:43:02 yeah yeah so this is what i was
1:43:04 wondering is this
1:43:05 even uh applicable under first principle
1:43:08 rule
1:43:10 what what do you mean like if they take
1:43:13 this as an axioma or a first principle
1:43:16 this is just fighting okay but
1:43:19 here's the thing yeah they are making a
1:43:22 session they're not even trying to
1:43:23 justify
1:43:24 a position i think that's very important
1:43:26 uh because this happens often
1:43:28 you know somebody comes up to me or
1:43:29 hijab or hamza imran and says
1:43:31 an atheist says this how do you respond
1:43:32 oh right right yeah so i i think i get
1:43:34 this question now okay
1:43:36 so the answer to this is it's very
1:43:37 powerful uh i just thought about it now
1:43:40 right i think this is a solution right
1:43:43 yeah not everything that is irrefutable
1:43:45 sorry not ev not everything that is
1:43:47 refutable
1:43:48 yeah uh not everything that is
1:43:51 irrefutable is
1:43:52 uh is true true yeah well everything
1:43:56 that is irrefutable is true sometimes
1:43:58 some you can have irrefutable things
1:44:00 like the spaghetti master
1:44:02 yeah now this is not a good example to
1:44:05 be honest
1:44:06 all right i know i know i know i don't
1:44:09 know i can
1:44:09 refuse this spaghetti but not everything
1:44:12 that is irrefutable
1:44:14 is true you can have some things which
1:44:16 are irrefutable
1:44:17 but which have no evidence that's that's
1:44:20 a possibility
1:44:22 it's conceivable to have something which
1:44:24 is irrefutable but which
1:44:25 like an axiom an axiom is exactly that
1:44:27 something which is an uh
1:44:29 which is no evidence for it but it's
1:44:31 irrefutable
1:44:32 yeah well all right
1:44:35 thank you very important um
1:44:39 uh uh what's it called when it comes to
1:44:40 atheist uh dialogues that
1:44:43 rather than getting involved in in the
1:44:46 actual thought experiment is sometimes
1:44:49 best to simply accept the thought
1:44:50 experiment
1:44:51 and then say okay what's the
1:44:52 implications of this and the
1:44:54 implications
1:44:55 yes are nothing for us i mean if any if
1:44:58 anything is positive if anything what
1:45:00 they're basically doing is
1:45:02 they're accepting a type of uh
1:45:04 epistemological nihilism like they
1:45:07 they don't they don't really know or uh
1:45:09 like they can't really know
1:45:11 like this is a barrier in terms of
1:45:12 knowing um
1:45:14 you know they can't know beyond the self
1:45:16 so if anything like hijab said they're
1:45:18 just starting off
1:45:19 and the thing which i find funny is that
1:45:21 you know in islam
1:45:22 we begin off with our starting paradigm
1:45:24 isla
1:45:25 our starting paradigm is the quran in
1:45:27 the sunnah from that we build ethics we
1:45:30 as in we expand upon the islamic ethics
1:45:32 we expand upon those things
1:45:34 and we use that to apply to new
1:45:36 realities such as space travel and
1:45:38 how do you pray in space and everything
1:45:40 and
1:45:41 our system is quite coherent now what
1:45:43 they do is they build up humanism
1:45:45 liberalism feminism
1:46:21 oh we're back sorry we had an issue um
1:46:27 long small show you can't build the
1:46:28 world view from that um
1:46:31 from that point so what we're going to
1:46:32 do uh brother
1:46:34 corsol did you have another question was
1:46:35 that yeah yeah another one i've
1:46:38 often encountered on the streets uh the
1:46:40 following one
1:46:41 uh sometimes you get dealt in their uh
1:46:44 discussions about uh you know
1:46:46 you could not you guys know about string
1:46:47 to your right
1:46:49 you know you know universe is coming
1:46:52 into existence popping in and out like
1:46:55 bubbles and stuff
1:46:56 so somehow they presupposed
1:46:59 that the bigger bubble being the uh the
1:47:02 bigger bubble that
1:47:03 contains little bubbles always was there
1:47:06 and always is
1:47:08 is there and i know there's no data on
1:47:10 this and it's some kind of
1:47:12 it's somewhat of a pseudoscience but do
1:47:15 you guys have
1:47:16 any other arguments to cover this
1:47:18 counter this instead of this
1:47:20 so again it goes back to that point that
1:47:22 i said earlier that
1:47:24 if we are to accept string theory
1:47:26 properly and there's
1:47:28 11 dimensions then you know uh
1:47:31 and we and we accept all of you know the
1:47:35 all all of their epistemology
1:47:37 essentially yeah
1:47:38 all right so what like what what they're
1:47:41 trying to say
1:47:42 they're trying to say that uh the
1:47:44 universe didn't need to have a
1:47:46 like always his noise was this is what
1:47:48 they're trying to say like the bigger
1:47:50 universe not this universe but the
1:47:51 bigger bubble
1:47:52 yeah yeah what they're trying to say so
1:47:54 now all i'll simply do is
1:47:56 because they're basically saying you
1:47:57 have this endless creation
1:47:59 and we just happen to be in one and then
1:48:01 you can add the antropic principle and
1:48:03 say
1:48:04 we just happen to be the one in that's
1:48:05 designed fair enough they've given it
1:48:07 they've given their perspective i'm
1:48:09 going to turn around i'm going to say
1:48:10 there's 37 universes
1:48:12 and ours is the second most important
1:48:17 it it's empirically equivalent
1:48:20 or i can do an n number
1:48:23 of of alternatives like what's the point
1:48:27 like they're not actually making a point
1:48:29 i think this is extremely important to
1:48:30 understand
1:48:32 firstly they're giving you something
1:48:34 which
1:48:35 doesn't have any evidence and they're
1:48:36 giving you a thought experiment what if
1:48:39 so fine say okay if that's fine okay i'm
1:48:41 giving you an alternative
1:48:44 some kind of it's like pseudoscience
1:48:47 they don't have any data on it i know
1:48:49 no they don't but even the thought
1:48:51 experiment as a thought experiment
1:48:54 you can give something you can give
1:48:56 another you can give something as
1:48:57 arbitrary as that
1:48:59 and and then still and say to them fine
1:49:01 you gave me this i give you this
1:49:03 yeah and what it doesn't it
1:49:06 it's neither here nor there that's right
1:49:08 that's a clever one here
1:49:09 that's a clever one there's neither here
1:49:12 nor there and and there's an infinite
1:49:13 amount
1:49:14 the thing is what i find funny about
1:49:16 these these people is that
1:49:18 they're just trying to escape the
1:49:19 inescapable order when it comes to
1:49:22 maybe there's a multiverse maybe with
1:49:25 spring theory
1:49:26 is true and there's 11 dimensions uh
1:49:28 maybe
1:49:29 panspermia that life came to earth via
1:49:32 you know aliens which which see the life
1:49:34 on earth maybe
1:49:36 consciousness is an illusion with
1:49:38 everything there's a possibility
1:49:40 and the level of skepticism is going
1:49:43 down to 0.001 percent
1:49:46 when it comes to the ideal boy being a
1:49:47 creator statisticism goes to a thousand
1:49:50 percent
1:49:51 and then it's like no no that's
1:49:52 irrational how is that possible oh
1:49:54 panspermia yes string theory yes
1:49:56 yeah so again fundamentally and i always
1:49:59 try and do this
1:50:00 and uh especially when talking to
1:50:02 atheists get to the root of the issue
1:50:04 which is
1:50:05 why are you being selectively skeptical
1:50:08 if you're gonna
1:50:08 be open to wild ideas then why not be
1:50:12 open to
1:50:13 the very rational idea of there being a
1:50:16 benevolent creator
1:50:17 who has created you with a purpose but
1:50:20 you know in addition
1:50:21 and uh it's a beautiful answer beautiful
1:50:23 enough time
1:50:24 i'm going to move on to the other two
1:50:27 brothers make sure you give my salam
1:50:31 also to another brother called
1:50:33 alexander alexander
1:50:36 alexander i'm not sure if he's there
1:50:38 anymore i don't think
1:50:40 i don't think no i will tell everyone
1:50:43 maybe he knows uh
1:50:44 alexander i'll pass it on each other
1:50:46 quick one minute
1:50:49 just let's add to
1:50:53 one more thing uh is that for us
1:50:56 like when i i've been working on the um
1:50:58 contingency
1:50:59 bargaining right so one of the things
1:51:01 that come into it which i think is very
1:51:03 powerful and under
1:51:04 used in western western philosophy even
1:51:08 in uh like medieval
1:51:11 those philosophers who specialize in
1:51:13 medieval islam
1:51:14 have not brought this to light
1:51:15 especially in like atheists theist
1:51:17 discussions yeah
1:51:19 which is uh an argument classically
1:51:21 known as the taqib argument
1:51:22 which is ha which is basically the
1:51:25 argument of composition
1:51:26 and this is a specifically er ebencinian
1:51:29 argument that's the part of his book
1:51:31 there's parts of it which are
1:51:32 problematic or whatever but in in in
1:51:34 a nutshell basically this is this is the
1:51:36 uh argument
1:51:38 that anything which is composed of parts
1:51:41 is dependent that's this extent of the
1:51:44 argument so if someone believes in a
1:51:45 multiverse
1:51:46 they're already saying there's more than
1:51:47 one of them so if they're saying there's
1:51:49 more than one of it then it's going to
1:51:50 be dependent
1:51:51 now if it's dependent then you still
1:51:52 have the infinite rigorous problem of
1:51:54 dependent things and that's why what
1:51:56 i've been seeing which was different to
1:51:58 a lot of the other people is he took um
1:52:01 the infinite regress
1:52:03 and he said let's go with it let's
1:52:04 pretend that there is an infinite
1:52:05 regress
1:52:06 and he said that um if even if there is
1:52:08 an infinite regress what's it depending
1:52:10 on
1:52:10 because the thing is if if there's an
1:52:12 infinite regress and it can be
1:52:13 rearranged or you can add and
1:52:15 subtract from here he argued
1:52:17 argumentative absurd him that
1:52:19 basically this infinite regress is not
1:52:20 actually as you think it is dependent
1:52:22 because it goes back to the composition
1:52:23 argument um so
1:52:26 it will always be as very strong
1:52:30 stabbing thorn in the side of the
1:52:32 atheist
1:52:33 that whatever theory or oscillating
1:52:35 universe or multiverse theory whatever
1:52:37 they want to bring
1:52:39 um eternal universes because don't
1:52:41 forget these individuals believed in an
1:52:43 eternal universe by the way they were
1:52:44 eternalists
1:52:45 that whatever you bring it's not going
1:52:47 to disturb
1:52:48 yeah and it's actually going to bring
1:52:50 more problems because for you you're
1:52:51 going to have to explain why
1:52:52 you can have or how is it explicable to
1:52:54 have something which is composed of
1:52:55 parts and therefore
1:52:56 subject to this assembly yes you've got
1:52:58 a bigger problem you've got a bigger
1:53:00 problem
1:53:00 you've got a bigger problem that's very
1:53:02 interesting
1:53:03 okay let's move on to the question from
1:53:06 abdulrahman
1:53:08 and sorry we can't add more people to
1:53:09 the studio we've
1:53:11 run out of time this week
1:53:17 um i have three questions however i'm
1:53:20 um i can ask later if you don't have
1:53:22 time
1:53:23 yes last one my yeah my first question
1:53:26 is
1:53:27 um so for example in
1:53:30 pakistan when they argue for a secular
1:53:34 society they say that
1:53:35 we all know that science is very
1:53:37 important for our country and
1:53:39 its progress and its economy and they
1:53:42 say that
1:53:44 and they kind of mock islam and when
1:53:46 they say that
1:53:47 okay if you have islamic government the
1:53:50 scholars
1:53:51 earlier they were quite hesitant of
1:53:53 photos
1:53:54 however uh now since the world didn't
1:53:57 care about them they just
1:54:00 now they came to realization okay photos
1:54:02 and videos are fine
1:54:04 and adding to this it's like now in
1:54:07 hindsight we can say that
1:54:09 theories can be false but they can have
1:54:12 workable models
1:54:14 so if there's some theory proposed by
1:54:16 scientists however it goes against
1:54:19 certain islamic principles are certain
1:54:22 ayats
1:54:23 um and then he implements that into a
1:54:25 workable model however
1:54:26 if in an islamic government it would be
1:54:28 stopped and that
1:54:30 man a scientist would be deemed a
1:54:32 heretic so
1:54:33 how would we solve this issue
1:54:36 please so i always find it very rich
1:54:39 when secularists try and use
1:54:41 science and say that islam can stop
1:54:43 science
1:54:45 and i would simply ask them well why
1:54:47 didn't secularists come up with science
1:54:49 why didn't atheists come up with science
1:54:51 why didn't skeptics come up with science
1:54:53 why was it
1:54:54 muslims who were pushing the science and
1:54:56 the inductive modern scientific method
1:54:58 people at hasanah been hate them
1:55:00 then later on the baton was taken by the
1:55:02 likes of
1:55:03 christian scientists and then later on
1:55:06 when this party has been going on
1:55:08 well in into 95
1:55:11 uh percent of its uh sort of history
1:55:14 then you then get
1:55:15 in the late victorian era and then
1:55:17 onwards
1:55:18 more secular scientists becoming
1:55:20 prevalent
1:55:21 the thing which is the most important
1:55:23 keep in mind is
1:55:25 what applies to one religion applies to
1:55:27 another religion
1:55:28 including the religion of liberalism
1:55:30 there's things that come
1:55:32 out in science which challenge
1:55:34 liberalism
1:55:35 such as the idea that gender equality is
1:55:38 not just a social construct
1:55:40 uh the patriarchy is not just a social
1:55:42 construct we're hardwired
1:55:44 for it and then what you get is you get
1:55:46 liberal feminists who try and challenge
1:55:48 it
1:55:48 and challenge science and cause a
1:55:50 wreckage in
1:55:51 in the scientific community by
1:55:53 challenging valid science
1:55:55 by saying no no we can't accept that
1:55:57 natural selection
1:55:58 engineered us to be patriarchal no no we
1:56:02 cannot accept that natural selection
1:56:04 made men more physically stronger
1:56:07 made men more aggressive no no we cannot
1:56:10 accept the idea
1:56:12 that gender roles is something which uh
1:56:15 was a stable
1:56:15 was a stable selection strategy so you
1:56:18 can say yeah islam
1:56:20 there may be things in islam which uh
1:56:23 which certain scientific theories
1:56:25 disagree with
1:56:26 and therefore muslims are less likely to
1:56:28 favor them well that's the same with
1:56:29 humanism
1:56:30 same with liberalism same with any of
1:56:32 these secular philosophies additionally
1:56:34 because we as muslims we believe science
1:56:36 from an instrumental perspective
1:56:38 that we can hold on to scientific
1:56:41 theories even though they contradict
1:56:43 us from an epistemic point of view such
1:56:45 as the steady state model
1:56:47 but it doesn't mean that we have to draw
1:56:49 the baby with the bath water
1:56:51 it doesn't mean that we have to
1:56:52 completely
1:56:54 uh you know disregard all of science
1:56:57 and and and just say okay we're not
1:56:59 gonna accept this because this
1:57:00 is not uh in line with the quran in fact
1:57:03 and this is very important
1:57:05 secular societies such as the ussr they
1:57:08 persecuted scientists
1:57:10 christian europe persecuted scientists
1:57:13 yet in the islamic world people who were
1:57:17 deemed heretics
1:57:19 were deemed heretics were called out to
1:57:21 be heretics but none were burnt at the
1:57:23 stake
1:57:24 yeah muslims put up with people who were
1:57:28 in the opposition
1:57:29 just like the prophet sallam put up with
1:57:32 the leader of the hypocrites
1:57:34 muslims put up with complete heretics
1:57:38 from a from a theological point of view
1:57:40 and even people who had ideas in terms
1:57:42 of science which went against
1:57:43 muslims but muslims never killed those
1:57:46 people
1:57:46 and the other thing is that making the
1:57:48 yardstick scientific
1:57:50 progress so we're going to choose a
1:57:52 society whether it's secular
1:57:54 or islamic based upon how well it does
1:57:56 scientifically
1:57:57 if we just look at the history of
1:57:58 science then we know that according to
1:58:00 that argument
1:58:01 then you should be choosing a theistic
1:58:02 society because it gives you a moral
1:58:04 imperative
1:58:05 that atheistic societies can't give you
1:58:08 additionally to that
1:58:09 who said science being a science
1:58:13 flourishing
1:58:14 is a yardstick for truth that the
1:58:16 society in which science flourishes
1:58:18 that's the true society and the science
1:58:20 and the societies in which science
1:58:21 doesn't flourish
1:58:22 is not the true society so we can
1:58:24 challenge them uh
1:58:26 from a uh philosophical perspective and
1:58:28 we can also challenge them
1:58:30 from a uh a a a a history perspective
1:58:34 the reason why i'm laughing is
1:58:35 uh muhammad hijab is a caveman i have no
1:58:38 idea how to use steam yard
1:58:39 there was a guy trolling and he managed
1:58:41 to learn how to block him
1:58:42 and that's a miracle that's the miracle
1:58:45 right there so jazakallah
1:58:48 we're going to move on to earth because
1:58:50 we run out of time
1:58:52 so over to you earth what's your
1:58:54 question
1:59:01 my english is not very good so but i'm
1:59:03 gonna try my best
1:59:05 sure uh why that there's
1:59:08 people they are muslims and some some of
1:59:11 them they are non-muslims
1:59:13 they say uh but but most most of them
1:59:16 they are muslims they say like
1:59:17 i've been searching to islam i say i
1:59:20 read the quran i read
1:59:22 the books of the sunnah muslim i say in
1:59:26 the quran everything but
1:59:28 is unlogic is like um
1:59:32 like a like a stupid thing or
1:59:35 it's not it's not a logic uh religion
1:59:39 you know what i mean yeah so
1:59:42 why did basically disbelieve and why do
1:59:45 they say it's it's illogical
1:59:47 uh yeah and there's some muslims that
1:59:49 they become
1:59:50 i mean in the other country they become
1:59:52 atheists because
1:59:53 they say like i did i read the quran
1:59:56 it's not
1:59:57 on logic and um the god
2:00:00 is like um a bad god and
2:00:04 he's not a good god and something like
2:00:06 that so yeah
2:00:07 then they say okay i'm i'm yeah yeah
2:00:10 the thing is look alhamdulillah we have
2:00:13 people who
2:00:14 become muslim we have people who leave
2:00:17 islam
2:00:18 the prophet sallam said people will
2:00:19 enter islam in crowds and leave
2:00:21 islaming crowds the fact is the quran is
2:00:25 a book of guidance and a book of
2:00:26 misguidance
2:00:28 it guides the sincere and it misguides
2:00:30 the insincere
2:00:31 it increases the disbelievers in their
2:00:34 disbelief and it increases the believers
2:00:36 in their belief so the first point
2:00:40 my brother is it doesn't matter what
2:00:42 people do
2:00:43 people doing a certain action doesn't
2:00:45 mean it's more likely to be true or more
2:00:47 likely to be false
2:00:48 there are people who are born
2:00:52 born and i know of people like this who
2:00:54 are born
2:00:55 in households in which believing would
2:00:58 be
2:00:58 impossible impossible from a logical
2:01:01 point of view their families are
2:01:02 disbelievers everyone's a disbeliever
2:01:04 and they turn out to be a muslim
2:01:06 and i know because the quran
2:01:09 tells us this that the son of a prophet
2:01:13 born in that loban noble lineage
2:01:16 who sees his own father as a figure
2:01:20 he apostates from islam and we're
2:01:22 talking about here nua
2:01:23 salaam sun so what people do
2:01:26 is not a yardstick and what's very
2:01:30 important is that we look at
2:01:32 the truthfulness of islam and the
2:01:34 falsehood of
2:01:36 uh disbelief not at why are some people
2:01:39 doing this and why are some people doing
2:01:40 this because allah already gives us in
2:01:42 the quran
2:01:43 an answer the truth is from your lord
2:01:45 whoever wills let him believe
2:01:47 whoever wills let him disbelieve why is
2:01:49 this
2:01:50 important the reason why this is
2:01:51 important is some people think
2:01:54 just by being a muslim who left islam
2:01:58 you somehow have something important
2:02:00 like you've done something important
2:02:02 or somebody who accepts islam and were
2:02:06 previously a disbeliever
2:02:08 that person other people look at and
2:02:10 they're like oh my god he's done
2:02:11 something really important
2:02:13 the fact is allah guides and
2:02:16 allah misguides and allah guides those
2:02:18 who deserve it
2:02:19 allah misguides those who don't want
2:02:22 guidance
2:02:23 so what people do should never be
2:02:26 of any concern in fact our father
2:02:29 ibrahim
2:02:30 he was the only believer on earth
2:02:33 and if everybody on earth was a believer
2:02:36 and he
2:02:37 did not believe it would not impact the
2:02:40 truthfulness of islam either
2:02:42 so the fact is and this is a very common
2:02:44 thing to fall into what people do
2:02:47 is totally irrelevant and it doesn't
2:02:51 show
2:02:51 either way the truthfulness or uh the
2:02:54 the
2:02:55 the invalidity of islam
2:02:58 says
2:03:14 some of them used to say who did which
2:03:18 who which of you or whom of you has this
2:03:21 increase in iman yes so the ones who
2:03:23 believe they'll say
2:03:24 yes it's increased us in belief
2:03:40 uh impurity with the impurity they
2:03:43 already had and they will die when
2:03:44 they're disbelievers
2:03:45 it's like when allah says
2:03:53 you know allah does not is not shy to to
2:03:56 bring forward a parable of a of a fly or
2:03:59 even that which is smaller than
2:04:04 as for those who believe they know it's
2:04:05 the truth from allah from their from
2:04:06 their lord
2:04:08 you know and as for those who disbelieve
2:04:10 they say what do what did allah
2:04:12 intend by this uh
2:04:16 by this method by this particular uh
2:04:19 parable and so everybody has
2:04:21 you know you can look at it's basically
2:04:23 like this and i and maybe this is not a
2:04:25 it's a logical way of answering this
2:04:27 question
2:04:29 but if you have an attachment to god if
2:04:31 you actually love god
2:04:33 right you're going to see all the good
2:04:35 in the world
2:04:36 and you're going to attribute to him and
2:04:38 you're going to see all the bad and
2:04:39 you're going to attribute it to the fact
2:04:41 that it's a test
2:04:42 and that you may even have tribute to
2:04:44 yourself so it's like
2:04:45 if you if you love your father and
2:04:48 someone says something bad of him
2:04:50 you're going to try and interpret it in
2:04:53 your understanding your paradigm of
2:04:54 actually my dad's a really good person
2:04:55 maybe done this
2:04:56 but those atheists are kind of like
2:04:59 those people who hate their parents
2:05:01 because anything that is said about them
2:05:03 they'll they'll believe it
2:05:04 anything that even if it's not verified
2:05:07 and they attribute that kind of attitude
2:05:08 or they have the same kind of attitude
2:05:10 these antitheists to god and to religion
2:05:13 in general so anything that happens in
2:05:14 the world or wise or
2:05:15 why is god doing this or what you know
2:05:18 the quran says
2:05:24 people think that they will be left
2:05:25 alone to
2:05:27 you know just like that and they will
2:05:30 not be tested they will say i believe
2:05:31 and they will not be tested
2:05:38 so we have tested those who came before
2:05:40 them and so allah will know
2:05:42 the ones who are truthful among them and
2:05:43 he will know the ones who are liars
2:05:46 this world is a test at the end of the
2:05:48 day if there's an atheist out there an
2:05:50 antitheus and he's got this
2:05:52 these spectacles on which he sees the
2:05:53 world in opposition to god and in
2:05:56 opposition to religion all these kinds
2:05:57 of things
2:05:58 but that's who allah is going to
2:06:02 increase the impurity with the impurity
2:06:03 they have already it's going to be a
2:06:04 snowball
2:06:05 impurity uh situation it's going to
2:06:08 just get worse and worse for them
2:06:10 they're going to be strangling
2:06:11 themselves with a longer rope
2:06:13 but as for those who believe you know
2:06:16 it's going to be everything that comes
2:06:17 down everything that from the religious
2:06:19 perspective
2:06:20 they're going to see in the best
2:06:21 presentation in the best possible way
2:06:23 and they're going to die
2:06:24 insha'allah's believers and that's
2:06:25 that's a very key thing absolutely and i
2:06:28 just want to
2:06:29 uh thank everybody for joining a live
2:06:31 stream we've been getting this question
2:06:33 uh a few times and it's been coming up
2:06:36 in previous live streams as well which
2:06:37 is
2:06:38 when is uh muhammad hijab going to be on
2:06:40 the joe rogan podcast inshallah
2:06:42 so guys look let me just give you a
2:06:44 little a little uh
2:06:46 opportunity here firstly
2:06:50 every single person should be in tune
2:06:52 with the seerah and they should
2:06:54 understand the prophet
2:06:54 sallam he went for the leaders he went
2:06:58 for the people of influence
2:06:59 somebody's saying i look like an
2:07:00 elephant but they're spelling elephants
2:07:01 yeah yeah it's not beneficial
2:07:03 look at this look at this you wish you
2:07:04 had this huh you wish you had that
2:07:06 be quiet so so when it comes to
2:07:11 the leaders the influencers the tribal
2:07:13 people in the past and today is
2:07:15 influencers like
2:07:16 joruggan so if you want to see
2:07:19 muhammad hijab speaking to joe rogan
2:07:22 something very simple needs to take
2:07:23 place which inshallah you'll get dodger
2:07:25 for
2:07:26 there's 450 people roughly watching this
2:07:28 right now
2:07:30 all you simply need to do is you simply
2:07:33 need to
2:07:34 tweet and tweet joe rogan tweet
2:07:37 uh hijab email joe rogan and just say to
2:07:40 him you should speak to hijab
2:07:41 this i mean if he got even 50 people
2:07:44 saying to him
2:07:45 do this he'll do the same thing that
2:07:46 conor did message and say okay let's
2:07:49 speak
2:07:49 and here's the thing which is very
2:07:51 important yeah it's not about
2:07:53 who the dakia speaks to it's about all
2:07:55 the followers it's not about
2:07:57 the per it's the same reason it debates
2:07:59 you know speaking to a particular person
2:08:01 it's not about the person it's about all
2:08:04 is social engineering it's all the
2:08:05 people watching
2:08:07 it's the impact it has when it comes to
2:08:09 pharaoh and musa
2:08:10 allah knows that musa is
2:08:13 going to have a hard time with farrow
2:08:16 and fir
2:08:17 is somebody who's not going to accept
2:08:18 the message who gets the message
2:08:20 between these two opponents and who acts
2:08:23 upon the message
2:08:24 the audience some people from side
2:08:27 some people from musa salaam side but
2:08:30 both of them do not budge but the people
2:08:31 budge and they
2:08:32 they go into different camps so you know
2:08:35 if you really want something like that
2:08:36 to happen then take action to make it
2:08:38 happen don't just assume it's going to
2:08:39 happen inshallah
2:08:40 jazakallah everybody for watching this
2:08:42 live stream every single saturday
2:08:44 we will be live insha'allah on sapiens
2:08:47 institute
2:08:48 and uh would you like to give some
2:08:50 concluding thoughts oh
2:08:51 i think it's it's a pleasure coming here
2:08:53 and listening to some of your answers as
2:08:55 well because
2:08:56 it increases my knowledge of especially
2:08:58 like evolution
2:08:59 biology and philosophy of science and
2:09:02 biology is
2:09:03 and generally i think like just being of
2:09:05 a high iq person
2:09:06 you know which i'm not used to is not
2:09:08 here
2:09:10 hamza is not here actually forgetting
2:09:13 ron for getting wrong
2:09:14 yes it's always good man that's always
2:09:16 good yeah no no i'm delighted it's been
2:09:18 a pleasure as well like
2:09:19 for those who have come and asked
2:09:21 questions and showed their face and
2:09:23 stuff like that
2:09:24 you know it's been it's been a pleasure
2:09:25 to answer your questions and get your
2:09:27 inputs as well
2:09:28 bless you all assalamu alaikum